RANDOM QUESTION

[JdNsane]

If you can't believe you are worth $1000 a verse, how are you going to make anyone else believe? Second this is a business....and I stress again this is a business. Some people need to quit rappin first and pick up a book and read and get some knowledge on business.
Not to put race into this but I hate it when I hear white people say...if you want to keep something from a black man....write it in a book.
People need to understand, ain't no 401K plans, retirement funds, pension plans, in this type of hustle. I've seen artist be in game, make some decent money and years later be broke and out on the street. Why....bad business. Should have picked up a book. If you would pick up a book and learn business....you probably would not want to be a rapper anymore. You'll discover other avenues.
Niggas is hatin on Dre because he won't drop Detox and is selling headphones. We should be congratulating the man. He convinced many people his headphones are the best and people are buying them at $300 a pair. Why even sell cd's. Detox would sell for $20 a cd... Dre may make $7 a cd. He would definitely go platinum. But a million sales of some $300 headphones...even if Dre got $50 a sale....this nigga gettin stupid breaded. He is a business man. Get educated. That's why I quit producing...I found other avenues for business and can avoid the BS that comes with the music industry.
GET EDUCATED!!!!!!

 

[antilabs]

the most important principal in business, i've found is finding the way to get checks for 2 racks 5 times a month rather than trying to get $20 500 times a month.

for some artists that's what a show represents vs. a cd sale.

 

[707north]

I wanted to throw this out there too. Its good to promote yourself outside of the Country. People in other parts of the world love our shit. Doing lots of shows is where you can make a good amount of Money.

 

[TAY CAPONE1]

I INVESTED IN FARMING. AND I CAN STILL DROP A RAP ALBUM WHENEVER I WANT. HARD WORK PAYS OFF...AND EXPERIENCE IS THE BEST TEACHER. YOU EITHER KNOW,OR DONT KNOW. WCM

 

[Gemini]

THESE FOOLS CHANGED THEIR STYLES AND TRIED TO BE MORE MAINSTREAM. WHEN BEFORE THEY WERE MORE GANGSTER AS SOLO ARTISTS. THEY HAD DECENT PRODUCTION, FEATURES,VIDEOS,ETC.

THEY COULDA GOT TIGHTER FEATURES FROM SOME OF THE HOMIES. FOR FREE.
BUT I THINK THEY THOUGHT THEIR FEATURES WERE GONNA. BE ALL THE PROMO THEY NEEDED.

I CAN'T FIGURE IF IT WAS THE WAY THEY HUSTLED IT OR IF IT WAS THE WAY CHANGED THEIR STYLE. OR WHAT HAPPENED. ON PAPER IT LOOKED GOOD. BUT IT FLOPPED HARDER THAN VLADE DIVAC WOULD IN THE PLAYOFFS

The question is, why is it that your Homies were left out to dry? 10K for a feature? This is the key element, as independents I keep hearing respect this & respect that, but the featured artist (the one being paid a large amount of money) doesn't have enough respect to give it a little push himself? Being that perhaps he has a bigger fan base or a so & so rapper presents blah blah blah... or holla at them people who put money in his pocket to a show of his to perform? Better yet, feature them on his next project. Last time I checked love & respect was a 2 way street. Especially in the independent game we are lacking that. People taking the money & running leaving it up to you push your shit. With that being said, does that featured artist really have love for the game? Have respect for you? Believe in you like you believe in him? I think not. Yet, your the stupid one for allowing yourself to get took. So in the end, who's the hustler & who got hustled?


The featured rapper took money in advance for your sales that you'll never make off one project and it's up to you to make that money back? Your not built for this if you can't sell Cd's? Your a hobby rapper? You don't got your hustle game right, invest? LMAO!!!!! Buying a house! That's an investment! It's not my fault, it's yours! I could sell Cd's and make my money back. That's your problem, but thanks for the money, Homie. Good luck! :classic:

Wow!!!!! Wait! It get's better! If another rapper presents your album he's charging you for it on top of making a cut off sales. This is the bullshit artist went through in the majors back in the day on top of being ripped off publishing points. This is why artist who were signed to majors left & went independent. To avoid all the bullshit of con men & smoke screens within the corporate business. Now, we're right back where we started and blame the corporate music business for killing the game?

"It's a dirty game, so you got to play dirty" is the ultimate cliche' line within the business. It was stated due to the major ripping off the nobles in the game. Now, it's simply a way to wash your hands & cleanse yourself from looking shady. Because the independent music game was to be free from all that & make your money. Not rip off your fellow artist.

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he doesn't exist" - Roger 'Verbal' Kint

 

[JimmydaButcher]

How is a feature going to help you move units when they can't move some them selves? Not to be negative but in all honesty 99% of independent rappers today would consider 1,000 pieces a successful release. 10$ retail and you'll be lucky to see 5 stacks before taxes. Minus the over head, your in the red or working for peanuts. Be realistic. In business your only as good as the #'s your putting up now. Without Connections or a nice budget your losing. If your brand is recognizable show dough and feature money is where it's at. I'd advise those to do like Clyde and Wiz and endorse something cuz without a hit that hustle will eventually cease as well.

 

[TAY CAPONE1]

@GEMINI-YOUR LAST POST IS THE REASON I DONT RAP WITH A LOT OF PEOPLE. THEY END UP UNAPPRECIATIVE ANYWAY. I PAID ABOUT 5 DIFFERENT ARTISTS AN AVERAGE OF $2000 2 FEATURE ON ONE OF MY PROJECTS...U DONT SEE ME COMPLAININ.I WAS HAPPY I COULD FEED MY PEERS. I SENSE BITTERNESS OR SOMETHING. MAYBE THE RAPPERS WITH A LIL CLOUT SHOULD JUST STICC TOGETHER AND FREEZE THE REST OUT. IVE ALWAYS SAID THE GAME GOT FUCCED UP WHEN PPL WHO SHOULDA STAYED FANS STARTED TRYING 2 BE ARTISTS. IT TAKES A LOT 2 HAVE A SOLID FAN BASE...AND THE REST IS PROBABLY LUCC. I JUST DONT SEE WHY SOMEONE WHO WAS AN ARTIST HAS SO MUCH ANIMOSITY AGAINST THE BUSINESS SIDE OF THINGS. I GUESS U THINK PPL SHOULD WORK 4 FREE. I RESPECT OPINIONS BUT ALL THE KNOWLEDGE IS BEING RECYCLED HERE CUZ WE ALL AGREE 2 DISAGREE. IN MY POSITION,IF ITS NOT PROFITABLE I DONT DO IT. MORE PPL WANT HANDOUTS THAN WANT 2 WORK. DOIN MUSIC IS USUALLY FUN.SELLIN IT IS THE HARD PART....AND IN THE RAPGAME SITTIN IN FRONT OF YOUR COMPUTER AINT GONNA MAKE U MUCH $$$.AND TALKIN DONT EITHER UNLESS U RUN A SEMINAR OR SOMETHING. THX 4 THE COMMENTS AND GOOD LUCC 2 EVERYBODY. THX 2 THE INFO IVE RECIEVED IN THIS POST IM RAISING MY PRICES....MAYBE IF ALL THE GOOD RAPPERS DID THAT, THE PPL IN THE WAY WOULD STOP RAPPIN OR ACTUALLY GO BACC 2 SUPPORTIN MUSIC.WHO KNOWS?? WE'RE ALL STILL WORKS IN PROGRESS.STAY HUMBLE BUT HUNGRY. PEACE AND LOVE-WCM

 

[Gemini]

@ Tay, yeah I can see how I may come across as bitter, but not the case. I just see it as every rapper today would be a bad investment. I 100% agree that everybody & their mama is a rapper or somehow music related. And perhaps that, just as the ease of recording and being accessible on the home computer was the genesis of the saturation.

With that came the whack Cd's being hustled in the street by any & everybody & after awhile the regular people stopped supporting that due to the albums being terrible. In that same sense, rappers, producers etc. got a hustle of their own and somewhere down the line felt they were famous or worth a certain amount of money.

If you read my first post in here I stated that I don't think there is anything wrong with paying, but it's seriously become where there is a lot of people digging deep in others pockets.

My main point is, I think we as independents could do more & seriously lock it down by coming in numbers. Working together & be paid, but too many believe they're superstars or are just plain greedy to where they don't believe in the destination. They truly don't believe we'll make it & want the fast money. That's where artist & con men separate. The so called business / con man labels himself a hustler and the belief in oneself is gone. Greed has taken over. Now, this can be dissected & viewed in many different ways, but like you stated, we agree to disagree.

The funniest thing to me is, a whole lot of people believing the hype on many artist, producers etc. and the sales pitch is, "This is how I feed my family." A few years later you stop to put gas and the infamous rapper who feeds his family by selling verses. The one who was pushing Cd's & doing $2,000 shows etc. The one who most people in his area dick rode due to believing he was a star on his way, is right behind the counter with a little name tag over his heart asking, "Is that it, Sir?" LOL! Bad investment? More like selling pipe dreams IMHO.

In short, this kind of shit is killing the independent game. People need to wake up.

 

[TAY CAPONE1]

NAME A RAPPER WHO CAN CALL HIMSELF A SUPERSTAR IN 2011. I DONT KNOW OF ANY. THE MUSIC BIZ HAS BEEN A GREED GAME SINCE BEFORE WE WERE BORN. E-40 CHARGED A FRIEND OF MINE 10 RACCS 4 A VERSE.HE WASNT IN THE RAP BIZ HE WAS A SINGER. I COULD SEE SOMEONE SAYING THATS OVERBOARD BUT I STILL CANT AGREE WITH THE $200 THEORY. I CHARGE A RACC OR BETTER FOR ANYTHING I DO ON A TRACC. THATS REASONABLE TO SOMEONE NORMAL IMO. I COULD TELL U WHY I FEEL THE GAME IS DIFFERENT BUT IT DONT MATTER REALLY. FUCC PHILOSOPHY,IM TALKIN FACTS BUT THIS IS ANOTHER OPINIONATED TOPIC. IM GLAD I GET TO SEE WHAT PPL FEEL. AND IM GLAD I HAVE A BETTER CATALOG THAN THE AVERAGE RAPPER AND STILL HAVE FAITH IN WHAT IM DOIN. ITS DIFFERENT STROKES 4 DIFFERENT FOLKS. SOME PEOPLE NEVER GET TO SEE THE PROS SO THEY BUILD THEORIES OFF THE CONS. I AVOID NEGATIVE ENERGY IF I CAN.U SHOULD TRY IT.LOL

 

[TAY CAPONE1]

SELF INVESTORS HAVE 2 MANY COMPLAINTS.SOME PEOPLE REALLY HANDLE BUSINESS AND DONT HAVE THE BACCYARD RAPPERS MENTALLITY.I APPRECIATE THOSE KINDA PEOPLE CUZ THEY KNOW MONEY IS WHAT MAKES THINGS HAPPEN IN THE REAL WORLD. MOST PLANS WITHOUT BUDGETS FAIL.U CAN QUOTE ME ON THAT 1. SPEND YOUR MONEY WISELY. OR DONT SPEND IT AND STAY RIGHT WHERE U ARE IN LIFE.WHO CARES?? WERE ALL OUR OWN INDIVIDUALS

 

[Gemini]

NAME A RAPPER WHO CAN CALL HIMSELF A SUPERSTAR IN 2011. I DONT KNOW OF ANY. THE MUSIC BIZ HAS BEEN A GREED GAME SINCE BEFORE WE WERE BORN. E-40 CHARGED A FRIEND OF MINE 10 RACCS 4 A VERSE.HE WASNT IN THE RAP BIZ HE WAS A SINGER. I COULD SEE SOMEONE SAYING THATS OVERBOARD BUT I STILL CANT AGREE WITH THE $200 THEORY. I CHARGE A RACC OR BETTER FOR ANYTHING I DO ON A TRACC. THATS REASONABLE TO SOMEONE NORMAL IMO. I COULD TELL U WHY I FEEL THE GAME IS DIFFERENT BUT IT DONT MATTER REALLY. FUCC PHILOSOPHY,IM TALKIN FACTS BUT THIS IS ANOTHER OPINIONATED TOPIC. IM GLAD I GET TO SEE WHAT PPL FEEL. AND IM GLAD I HAVE A BETTER CATALOG THAN THE AVERAGE RAPPER AND STILL HAVE FAITH IN WHAT IM DOIN. ITS DIFFERENT STROKES 4 DIFFERENT FOLKS. SOME PEOPLE NEVER GET TO SEE THE PROS SO THEY BUILD THEORIES OFF THE CONS. I AVOID NEGATIVE ENERGY IF I CAN.U SHOULD TRY IT.LOL

LOL! The most positive thing I see in the whole rap game is not the amount of money I make, but any of the money I make goes to my family. I don't drink it, or smoke it. Family first & the biggest pay off is the smile on my kids faces. It get's no better than this. Fuck everything else.

 

[dev650524]

from a consumer point of view i feel the production & lyrics has to be tight for me to purchase your album. i dont care how much money you put into promotion if it's not quality material i aint buyin it. i feel alot of established bay area artist dont get the right production so there material sounds dated( old) they need to put out quality music then spend the money on promotion. also start touring you got to be grass roots about it like techn9ne.

 

[TAY CAPONE1]

I SEE THERES AN INDEPENDENT GAME WHERE PEOPLE ACTUALLY HAVE SOLD SOME REAL UNITS AND CAN DO SHOWS,FEATURES,ETC. AND PEOPLE RESPECT YOUR GRIND. THEN U HAVE THE INDEPENDENT GAME WHERE EVERYBODY HAS THE "I NEED ON" ATTITUDE AND THEY END UP HATIN IF U DONT BREAK YOUR NECC 2 HELP THEM WITH THEIR CAREER. THATS EXACTLY WHY RAP ARTISTS ARE SUPPOSED 2 HAVE A LABEL AND ITS THE LABELS JOB 2 PROMOTE U RIGHT. SELF PROMOTION IS NOT A JOB. NOBODY'S GOING 2 PAY U 2 PROMOTE YOURSELF. HOWEVER,ALL THE OTHER THINGS IN THIS BIZ COST MONEY. PEOPLE GET FREE BEATS...AND EXPECT 2 MAKE MONEY OFF OF THE MUSIC. THE QUALITY IS USUALLY NOT UP 2 PAR. PEOPLE THINK FEATURES SHOULD COST $200. THAT ALONE SHOWS ME WHAT KIND OF QUALITY THE PROJECT WILL BE. I WOULDNT EVEN WANT 2 RAP ON SOMEBODYS ALBUM WHO OFFERS ME THAT CUZ I KNOW IT AINT GOIN NOWHERE BUT THE INTERNET. ITS A DOG EAT DOG BIZ AND AINT NO ROOM 4 EMOTIONS IN A BUSINESS LIKE THIS. BOTTOM FEEDERS THINK THEY DESERVE THE TOP SPOTS...THIS SHIT IS CRAZY..AND ITS EXACTLY WHY AFTER 5 YEARS OF TRYING 2 DO THE DEMOCRAT THING AND RUN A LABEL I HAD 2 FALLBACC. 2 MANY EXPECTATIONS AND NOT ENOUGH WORK BEING DONE. I WORKED HARD 2 ESTABLISH MYSELF WHERE I AM TODAY...AND THE RAP BIZ DOES NOT DEFINE ME AS A PERSON...BUT IF IT AINT ABOUT MONEY IT AINT ABOUT SHIT. I SEE WHY SOME TIGHT RAPPERS HAVE NO FANS NOW. THEY GOT THE GAME FUCCED UP. MY FUTURE PLAN IS 2 GO WHERE IM IN DEMAND AT...UK,GERMANY TYPE SHIT. PPL HERE HAVE GOTTEN SPOILED AND DONT REALLY APPRECIATE WHATS REAL. IF U HAD 2 LIVE LIFE WITHOUT MUSIC, WHAT KIND OF PERSON WOULD U BE?? AT LEAST APPRECIATE THE ART AND HANDLE YOUR BUSINESS ACCORDINGLY. OR BETTER YET....STAY A FAN AND STOP DREAMIN AND SPEAKIN ON THE BIZ LIKE YOUVE BEEN AN EXEC AT A REAL LABEL. REAL LABELS SPEND MONEY AND DONT TAKE SHORTCUTS. U CAN TELL BY THE QUALITY OF MUSIC. SIMPLE AS THAT.

 

[antilabs]

rapping to some (most) people is their model trains, or their remote controlled cars, or crochet knitting. it's a pass time, a hobby, somenthing that makes them feel good or some shit, ionno.

that's coo and all but when those people try to bump and throw business philosophy and theory w/people that really have done this, really are doing it, or really have a shot at doing it, that's where it goes all bad.

 

[lopro]

If it weren't for antilabs, tay, stretch, gemini, etc., b.a.r.t. would be boring as fuck. I like all this business talk lately. I'm soaking in shit that might pertain to me, and I think the 20+ other "rappers" on this site should too.

 

[TAY CAPONE1]

^^^^THATS NORMAL ON THE SICCNESS...LOL. GREAT POST @ANTILABS. THATS THE REAL PROBLEM. I FEEL LIKE IM KICCIN A DEAD HORSE.LOL

 

[Walkin]

how much love, or should I say money, would there be in European countries? I know there are die hards out there that like west coast rap but i guess I'm asking if there's enough to sustain long term endeavors as opposed to a quick fix?

 

[Gemini]

rapping to some (most) people is their model trains, or their remote controlled cars, or crochet knitting. it's a pass time, a hobby, somenthing that makes them feel good or some shit, ionno.

that's coo and all but when those people try to bump and throw business philosophy and theory w/people that really have done this, really are doing it, or really have a shot at doing it, that's where it goes all bad.

Who's really "Done this, really doing it." in here in your opinion? And who are the hobby rappers you keep referring to?

 

[phreakey]

i dont think you should judge people for trying. not everybody has a budget to afford a feature for $1000. a lot of people are trying to do the best with the little they have. even if you do have a budget, the rap game has the same odds as a slot machine. but there are other avenues and technology has lowered the cost of professional services for independent artists/labels making it more affordable for those who want to take a shot. "you get what you pay for" isnt true in the music business. plus it should be a two way street. if you are charging people for services, then you should also be paying people for services as well. also the level of professionalism has seriously diminished . if you dont know how to do something then you better be able to learn some new shit or you gotta break bread and hire someone. im not talking about do it all yourself. im more talking like if you dont know how to use email. that type of shit. but people always judge people based on what they think success is and what their goals are but in actuality(is actuality a real word?) we all have different visions dreams and goals and we all have different ways to get there. so you really cant knock someone for not paying thousands of dollars on features today because everybody started somewhere right? but you never know the person that couldnt afford a verse today might be the one in the future thats getting cashed out for verses tommorrow.

 

[antilabs]

@gemini:

How about anybody that's ever had 10,000+ people checking for them and their projects at any given point in time. Imho, generally speaking, that's the threshold for what constitutes a sustainable amount of interest beyond a "hustle," and puts you in "career" territory. This is measurable in a number of different ways, it used to be primarily by sales. Now useful measurement tools are represented by Facebook traffic, Twitter follows, Youtube views and Last.fm statistics.

It's not my prerogative to call anyone out, but everyone here should know independently which side of the line they land on, and overall it doesn't matter to me which side anyone lands on specifically.