THE FAKEST RELIgION

40ozthug99 · Feb 3, 2004

damm this thread got fuckin long...

EDJ · Feb 6, 2004

2-0-SIXX,

YOU STRESSED, "How and why is it the ONLY LOGICAL explanation?"

ONE UNIVERSE, ONE EARTH, ONE TRUTH. AND THAT TRUTH IS PRESENTED BY AN ORgANIZATION USED FOR THAT PURPOSE. YOU EVA WONDERED WHY AND HOW CAN THERE BE SO MANY RELIgIONS?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "A LOGICAL man doesn’t come to a conclusion or believe in something without solid evidence or proof."

EXACTLY.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "That’s like me telling you that a “Uni” exists. You ask, “whats a Uni?” I tell you, “a Uni is a green flying midget” you ask, “How do you know it exits?” I say, “Because it is the only explanation for our existence”. This is obviously illogical and you would demand proof. Same goes for your claim of “god” or anybody else’s claim."

NOW YOUR DOWN-PLAYIN' WHAT I'M STRESSIN'. I JUST DON'T BELIEVE SOMETHIN' CAUSE WORD OF MOUTH. YO' BOY AIN'T THAT gULLIBLE NOW. NOT EVERY gAME SPITTED gONNA BE SOAKED CAUE NOT EVERY gAME SPITTED IS "TRUE gAME SPITTED".

THEN YOU STRESSED, "No EDJ, I’m sure you WANT to believe you are correct. Nobody WANTS to find out that they were wrong. I agree that the Truth is the Truth and in order to find the TRUTH one must use logic and reason to get there."

AND HOW YOU KNOW I AIN'T USED LOgIC AND REASON?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I don’t need any proof from you because I already know you are incapable of providing proof."

THAT'S A BOLD STATEMENT AND JUST CLOSES DOORS. YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M CAPABLE OR INCAPABLE OF PROVIDIN'. YOU'RE TOO STUK IN YOUR MINDSET PLAYA.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "What you should do is ask yourself personally what PROOF do you really have?"

I HAVE. AND THAT'S WHY I BELIEVE WHAT I BELIEVE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "What evidence do you, EDJ, have that is so strong that you call yourself a LOGICAL thinker?"

THE WORD, PROPHECIES, HISTORICAL DATA THAT BAKS UP OCCURRENCES, AND KNOWLEDgE THAT NO MAN POSSESSES THAT ONLY SOMEBODY THAT KNEW ABOUT MODERN SCIENCE COULD'VE SPOKE ON.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Faith?"

FAITH COMES AFTER THE FACT AND IS NOT THE EVIDENCE ITSELF.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Faith is something that no man needs."

YOU THINK? I BEg TO DIFFER. THINK ABOUT IT NOW. IT IS A KNOWN FACT THAT "EVERY" MAN NEEDS FAITH. HOW SO? I AIN'T ONLY TALKIN' BOUT RELIgION AND SPIRITUALITY. I'M TALKIN' BOUT THE ACTUAL DEFINION OF THE WORD.
FAITH) THE ACT IN BELIEVEIN' IN SAMETHIN'. SO YOU MUST BELIEVE IN SOMETHIN'. WHETHA IT'S EVOLUTION OR IN YOURSELF. OR ELSE YOU WOULDN'T HAVE NO PURPOSE OR NO SET OF BELIEFS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Faith leads to distortion, untruths, fairy tales. Faith is worthless, pointless and a contradiction to logic."

FAITH IN SAMETHIN' CAN LEAD TO N-E-THANg. IT'S ALL ON YOU WHAT YOU PUT YOUR FAITH INTO.

HERESY,

YOU STRESSED, "@edj i've doing my thing."

HANLIT. DO WHAT YOU DO. I NEED TO gET AT YOU CAUSE WHAT YOU DO CAN INVOLVE ME SINCE WE IN THE SAME gAME.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Me not getting in contact with you has nothing to do with what you believe."

WHEEEEW. gLAD TO HEAR THAT SHIT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You told me what you believe damn near 2 and a half years ago."

NOT AS THOROUgH AS YOU PERCEIVE THEM NOW.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Stop looking for sympathy or reading too much into stuff."

SYMPATHY? WHAT I NEED SYMPATHY FOR? SO WHICH ONE IS IT? SYMPATHY OR READIN' TOO MUCH INTO SOMETHIN'?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "That shit aint keeping it real, stop getting all emotional and shit."

WHAT AIN'T KEEPIN' IT REAL? STAYIN' IN TOUCH WITH YO' FOLKS?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "If you arent a jehovie you shouldnt be worried about the terms I use."

51ST OF ALL,
WHAT THE FUK IS A JEHOVIE? LOL

XNDLY,
I ASKED WHY YOU DISERESPECTIN' ONE AND NOT ALL. I WAS JUST CURIOUS. CALL IT WHAT YOU WANT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I don't use that term because of you."

WHO SAID YOU DID? WHY WOULD YOU EVEN USE IT CAUSE OF ME?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I used it before I even knew you."

gOOD FOR YOU. WHY?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I have dedicated an entire song to catholic priests...do you see mcleanhatch complaining? Nope."

HAS MCLEANHATCH HEARD YOUR SONg? DID HE MARINATE ON THE MESSAgE? IS MCLEANHATCH A DEVOTED CATHOLIC? DOES HE BELIEVE EVERYTHANg CATHOLOCISM STANDS FOR? OR IS HE ASHAMED OF THE CURRENT STATE OF THE RELIgION ALONg WITH ALL THE RAPE ALLEgATIONS THAT HAVE SURFACED WITH CATHOLIC PRIESTS? IS HE CONVICTED OF HIS CONVICTIONS WITH THAT FAITH? WOULD HE PUT HIS LIFE ON THE LINE FOR HIS FELLOW CATHOLIC? OR WOULD HE KILL THEM IF THEY WERE FROM A DIFFERENT COUNTRY AND THE U.S STARTED A WAR WITH THAT COUNTRY?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "If the shoe fits wear it. If it doesn't oh well."

WHICH ONE IS IT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I don't care if they are using my name, your name, the presidents name, a dope fiends name or a corrupted interpretation of HA-SHEMS name."

HA-SHEM? DON'T TELL ME THAT'S ANOTHA INTERPRETATION OF YHWH? BUT THE DIVINE NAME SHOULDN'T BE BLASPHEMED OR USED IN VAIN. IF YOU KNOW OF SCRIPTURE, YOU SHOULD ATLEAST KNOW THAT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I respect NO religion and I will say what I want about any of them."

DO WHAT YOU DO.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Using a name means what to me? I'm supposed to give them a pass? I'm supposed to stop saying what I say?"

NAW, IT MEANS THAT IF THEY USE THE NAME OF THE ALMIgHTY IN THEY NAME, WHY IS YOU gONNA DISRESPECT THE MOST HIgHEST, JUST TO DISRESPECT THEM?"

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Since you are obviously offended by it (if not you would not have mentioned it or addressed it) I will rephrase my statements. Take any version you want.

"The top three unsound christian cult spin offs are J.W.'S, MORMONS AND CATHOLICS"

OR

"The top three unsound christian cult spin offs are JEHOVIES, BIKE BOYS (OR RIGHT TO CENSOR) AND BLOODY MARYS"

Does that work for you or do I have to use a more ghrapic/extreme name for the mormons and catholics?

Stop being sensitive."

AND YOU STOP TRYIN' TO LABEL MUTHA-FUKAS. BUT THE SHIT CAME OUT YOUR gRILL, BETTER YET, IT WAS TYPED THRU YOUR FINgERS FROM YOUR MENTAL. I SPOKE UP ON IT CAUSE IF YOU gONNA DISRESPECT, DON'T LET IT BE BIAS. BE ALL THE WAY WITH IT. FUK BEIN' LUKEWARM, YOU EITHA HOT OR COLD.

EDJ · Feb 6, 2004

MIggIDY,

YOU STRESSED, "Most of the time I don't respond to insignificant stuff and only stress on the major shit but come on now.
Hating? Stop being so deffensive bro.
You know I was just playin, you even pointed it out below."

DAMN, NOW I KNOW YOU SKIPPED OVER A BUNCH OF SHIT I STRESSED. I ON THE OTHA HAND, THOROUgHLY gO THRU YOUR MESSAgE MAKIN' SHO' I DON'T MISS SHIT. WAY TO MAKE IT SOUND LIKE I AIN'T SHIT. BUT YOU DON'T PLAY WITH MY SPIT TO TRY TO DEVIATE SOMEBODY.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Lies? Lies is your belief and the Mormon belief that you won't suffer for turnin your back on your creator and allying with Satan."

WHOA! WHOA! WHOA! MEDIEVAL-LOAK, SLOW YOUR ROLE. LET'S DECIPHER YOUR MESSAgE AND YOUR MISPERCEPTION OF THANgS.
51ST OF ALL,
NOW YOU TRYIN' TO POINT FINgERS WITH ERRONEOUS INFORMATION.
XNDLY,
HOW IS MUTHA-FUKAS TURNIN' THEY BAK ON THEY CREATOR AND ALLYIN' WITH SATAN?
3RDLY,
YOU HUNg OVER THIS SUFFERIN' ISSUE. YOU MUST WANT (gOD) TO TORMENT AND MAKE MUTHA-FUKAS SUFFER. YOU HAVE YET TO ADDRESS MY QUESTION(S) ABOUT WHAT I'VE PRESENTED ON THIS THREAD(WHICH POSED MY QUESTIONS ABOUT A LOVIN' AND JUST gOD ETERNALLY TORMENTIN' HIS OWN CHILDREN FOR AN AVERAgE 80 YEARS OF LIFE IN SIN).

THEN YOU STRESSED, "We've been through this before, so I ain't going that route again...."

I WONDER WHY? HMMMM?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Not according to your logic, it's fucked up cuz this Loving God won't bring all of his children up to Heaven with him"

51ST OF ALL,
MAN WAS NOT MADE TO DWELL IN HEAVEN. THAT WAS NOT(gOD'S) ORIgINAL PURPOSE AND INTENTION FOR MAN. (gOD) HAS CELESTIAL BEINgS FOR THAT.
XNDLY,
I NEVA SAID IT WAS FUCCED UP THAT (gOD) HAS TO JUDgE HIS CHILDREN. IT'S LIKE DISCIPLININ' YOUR CHILDREN. IT HURTS TO WHOOP THEM.

TO BE CONTINUED................

WHITE DEVIL · Feb 7, 2004

hiphopthugsta said:

LOL

EDJ · Feb 7, 2004

CONTINUED....

MIggIDY,

YOU THEN STRESSED, "Oh now it's ok huh? Now it's ok for this Loving God to be an asshole...."

HOW'S HE AN ASSHOLE? HE'S NOT TORTURIN' HIS CHILDREN. HE'S gIVIN' THEM A CHANCE TO REPENT OR gET CUT OFF FOREVA. THAT SOUNDS MORE JUST AND LOgICAL THAN BEIN' TORTURED FOREVA.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I may not be a Christian fanatic but I try to follow Jesus's teachings as much as my mortal mind and body allows."

FANATIC? THEN WHAT'S UP WITH THE ILLUSTRATION ON YOUR SIg?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "The difference between you and I is that I understand why our Loving God punishes those who fall under Satan's spell."

51ST OF ALL,
(gOD) DOES NOT PUNISH. YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW. WHAT KIND OF gOD WOULD gO AROUND PUNISHIN'?

XNDLY,
THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN YOU AND I IS THAT I DON'T FOLLOW CONVENTIONAL CHURCH DOgMA.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "LOL! It is not my way of thinking but it's my assumption about your way of thinking. I'm wrong? No not all. Look at your answer above and below. It is exactly what I expected."

QUIT SUCCIN' YOUR OWN DIK. AS YOU STRESSED, YOUR WAY OF THINKIN' IS YOUR ASSUMPTIONS. AND THAT'S NOT A gOOD WAY TO THINK. BEFORE YOU JUMP THE gUN, MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHAT THE FUK YOU TALKIN' BOUT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I was speaking of loved ones in general and not just your loved ones. And keep in mind that I said nothing negative about them."

YOUR ASSUMPTIVE BEHAVIOR IS ONCE AgAIN ON A RAMPAgE. YOU INSINUATED THAT LIFE WON'T BE gIVEN TO MY DEAD FRIENDS, THINKIN' EVERYBODY I HANg AROUND OR LOVED WAS EVIL AND THUS IN YOUR MENTALITY IS "HELLBOUND".

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Again bro, you're being too deffensive. I ain't your enemy so don't take my words as if I meant them to be offensive."

AgAIN CUZZ, YOUR ASSUMPTIVE BEHAVIOR HAS CAUSED ME TO TAKE OFFENSE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "The point I'm tryin to make is that the logic behind your loving God idea is contradictory."

HOW'S THAT? YOU TRYIN' TO HAVE YOUR CAKE AND EAT IT TOO. AS I STRESSED BEFORE, DON'T PUT ME IN YOUR ASSUMPTIVE WAY OF THINKIN'.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I am a father, and I love my son more than words can say.
I wouldn't hesitate to bring him to Heaven with me if I had the choice. That is how much I love him, I would look past his flaws and accept him no matter what."

SO IF THERE IS SUCH A REWARD AS HEAVEN, YOU WOULD KILL YOUR SON IF YOU WERE DYIN' SO HE COULD COME WITH YOU?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "But God is much stronger than me, he is able to look past this carnal emotion and judge his own son."

I KNOW THIS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "People will argue here that even this is fucked up, they say "a loving God wouldn't even think twice about accepting his children's flaws"....
Knowing that, what difference does it make whether he throws his son in Hell or lets him die for eternity?"

THE DIFFERENCE IS THE TORURE AND EXCRUCIATIN' PAIN ONE IS SUPPOSEDLY TO ENDURE IF "HELL" IS AN ACTUAL PLACE AS DESCRIBED BY POPULAR CHURCH DOgMA. WOULD YOU RATHER KNOW YOUR SON IS RESTIN' FOREVA AND IN YOUR MEMORIES OR THAT HE IS IN JAIL gETTIN' RAPED FOREVA IN AgONIZIN' PAIN? NOT ONLY PHYSICAL BUT MENTAL AND EMOTIONAL?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Either way, his son won't make it to heaven and live with his Father."

LIKE HEAVEN IS THE ULTIMATE REWARD? YOU HAVE BEEN CONDITIONED TO HOLD THAT TRUE. AS I TOLD YOU BEFORE, HEAVEN IS NOT THE PLACE FOR MANKIND. WE WERE PUT ON EARTH FOR A PURPOSE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "EDJ say what you want, but you cannot argue against this...."

YES I CAN. I HAVE AND I WILL.

Rumpelstiltskin · Feb 8, 2004

Morans are fake.

Satanism is a fascinating philosophy.
I know some hard core satanists that have faith 10 times stronger than most religious practitioners that I know.

Me..I am Christian.

HERESY · Feb 8, 2004

edj you have often stated

"THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN YOU AND I IS THAT I DON'T FOLLOW CONVENTIONAL CHURCH DOgMA."

I agree with your statement. YOU don't follow conventional church dogma. You follow the J.W. dogma/doctrine. Not only that but you contradict yourself. You *imply* that god does have to judge and discipline his people. Later on you say he gives them a chance or they get cut off but after that you say god does NOT punish. If god does NOT punish why are people cut off? Doesn't a judge or parent punish?

now lets address what you typed ot me:

"AND YOU STOP TRYIN' TO LABEL MUTHA-FUKAS. BUT THE SHIT CAME OUT YOUR gRILL, BETTER YET, IT WAS TYPED THRU YOUR FINgERS FROM YOUR MENTAL. I SPOKE UP ON IT CAUSE IF YOU gONNA DISRESPECT, DON'T LET IT BE BIAS. BE ALL THE WAY WITH IT. FUK BEIN' LUKEWARM, YOU EITHA HOT OR COLD."

What you're saying is the equivilent of me telling a klansman to not just call me a nigger but that he should also call a latino a spic and an asian a slant. It doesn't work. I LABEL WHOEVER THE HELL I WANT TO LABEL BECAUSE THEY LABEL THEMSELVES. I DIDN'T COME UP WITH THE NAME MORMON. THE FOUNDER OF THE DOCTRINE DID AND HIS FOLLOWERS STUCK TO IT. IF I CHOSE TO BE DISRESPECTFUL THATS ME. I RESPECT *NO* MANS RELIGION. BECAUSE I DIDN'T SAY ANYHTING ABOUT MORMONS MEANS I'M LUKE WARM? LMAO! YOU MAKE NO SENSE AT ALL. BECAUSE I FAILED TO ADDRESS A CATHOLIC AS PEDO FOLLOWER OR CHOIR BOY I'M BIASED? LMAO!

QUICK QUESTION. WHY DON'T *YOU* ADDRESS THE PEOPLE WHO DISRESPECT GOD ON THIS BOARD? YOU ARE COMING AT ME FOR BEING DISRESPECTFUL TO RELIGIONS AND PEOPLE WHO LABEL THEMSELVES. DO YOU TELL THOSE WHO DISRESPECT GOD TO DISRESPECT YOUR GOD (I ASSUME ITS YHWH) TO DISRESPECT ALLAH? DO YOU TELL THEM TO DISRESPECT KRSNA? DO YOU TELL THEM TO DISRESPECT RA? DO YOU EVEN ADDRESS THE DISRESPECT?

THATS BIAS. HOWEVER SINCE YOU *DID* ADDRESS IT I WILL TONE IT DOWN. THAT WAY SEEDS OF DISCORD WON'T BE SOWN.

"NAW, IT MEANS THAT IF THEY USE THE NAME OF THE ALMIgHTY IN THEY NAME, WHY IS YOU gONNA DISRESPECT THE MOST HIgHEST, JUST TO DISRESPECT THEM?" "

THE NAME OF THE ALMIGHTY IS NOT JEHOVAH AND IT NEVER HAS BEEN. THE HEBREW ALPHABET DOESNT EVEN HAVE A "J" NOR DOES IT HAVE VOWELS (VOWELLS ARE IMPLIED/SAID NOT WRITTEN). NOT ONLY THAT BUT "JEHOVAH" DIDNT COME AROUND UNTIL THE 17TH CENTURY. I SEE "THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST AND LATTER DAY SAINTS". WHEN I SMASH ON THEM IS THAT DISRESPECT TO YESHUA? NOPE. YOU MAKE NO SENSE. I DON'T CARE WHO'S NAME THEY USE. IM SUPPOSED TO SAY "THEY ARE USING GODS NAME IM GOING TO RESPECT THEM" AND GIVE THEM A PASS? LOL!

"HA-SHEM? DON'T TELL ME THAT'S ANOTHA INTERPRETATION OF YHWH? BUT THE DIVINE NAME SHOULDN'T BE BLASPHEMED OR USED IN VAIN. IF YOU KNOW OF SCRIPTURE, YOU SHOULD ATLEAST KNOW THAT."

AT THIS TIME THE ONLY THING I WILL TELL YOU IS TO RESEARCH JUDAISM AND THE HEBREW LANGUAGE.

EVERYTHING ELSE (MCLEANHATCH,CATHOLICS) WAS SIMPLY STATED TO BRING UP A POINT. YOU COME OFF AS I'M SAYING THESE THINGS AND BEING DISRESPECTFUL BECAUSE OF *YOU*. THATS *NOT* THE CASE. ME NOT CALLING AND STAYING IN TOUCH HAS NOTHING TO WITH YOU FOLLOWING WHAT YOU FOLLOW.

:HGK:

707 loc · Feb 8, 2004

I THINK CATHOLICS ARE A JOKE.... I THINK ALIANS CLONED US .....GOD MADE MAN IN HIS OWN IMAGE... EZEKIEL SAW UFO'S

miggidy · Feb 9, 2004

^^^^
That is not totally out of the picture.
Look into the book of Enoch and Sumerian tablets.

EDJ,
LMAO!!!!
You literately had me laughin while readin your thread, I'll respond later tonight....

miggidy · Feb 10, 2004

EDJ said:

No I don't skip the important things that are relevant to our convo.
But I do skip insignificant stuff, time is money....
Speakin of time, I won't be in here as often as I used to (kind of like you).
Baby mama drama on mine, so I gotta focus on that for the time being.

EDJ said:

Erroneous info eh? How about your erroneous JW based belief of no eternal damnation? No different than the Mormon belief of reincarnation. Say what you wanna say about where you stand but the "no hell" belief is only shared by you and JW's when it comes to those who read the bible.

Now you ask how is it that people have turned their back on their creator and allying with Satan; well that's simple.
Satan has a lot of influence over the negative things we do.
He has a clear pattern in the scripture with tryin to spoil God's children, for example Adam and Eve, the Nephilim, and so on.
Satan has changed his strategy as of late, remaining unseen and pullin strings behind curtains.
People are allying with Satan left and right without even realizing it. Their minds have become currupt to the point that you even have lost souls worshipping Satan. Yes it's gotten that bad....
Those and many others are the people who are allying with Satan and turning their back on their creator....

You say that I'm stuck with the eternal torment issue and that I've yet to answer your question.
Hmmm.... The only one stuttering here is you, just look at your argument supporting your personal belief. And I've answered what ever question you're talking about.
I don't want God to punish anyone for eternity, I am not the Judge, he is.
However I'm not the one in denial here, you are. You are in denial that such a loving God would torment his own children. Yet you believe that this same loving God will not give his own children eternal life. How is it that one is worse than the other EDJ?
You gotta see your own logic here, it doesn't make any sense for Him to punish his children for ever by killing them for ever, just like you admitted. Killing them for ever is no different than tormenting them for ever because either way, they won't live for ever. Either way, they're still going to miss the boat.
How can this loving God do such a thing to his own children?
You say it's punishment but what kind of punishment is killin your own children and denying them eternal life????

You either accept the scripture as it is without spining it, or you don't accept it all.
You cannot stand in between with your own ideals...
Your belief is heavily flawed and has no foundation EDJ,
it's time to humble your ego and accept reality bro....

EDJ said:

It's easy, you are fixated on your JW based ideals.
But we can go that route again, (like we already haven't) it's fine with me....

EDJ said:

I agree, God's original plan for man was for us to reside on Earth but with eternal life. You seem to have forgotten that....

Now you say God disciplines his children and you compare eternal death to a whoopin. Why whoop them if you can punish them without getting physical?

EDJ said:

You said it yourself, it's fucked up for God to torture his children, well with that logic it's also fucked up for him to deny his children their daily bread AKA life.... Where's your consistancy?

EDJ said:

LOL! I'm a fanatic for visually expressin what I believe in?
What am I shovin it down your throat?

EDJ said:

LOL... A while back you said it was punishment, but yeah we reap what we sow yet it is he who Judges us.

I follow the bible, you follow a theory originated by a man who claims he was inspired by God but time after time his actions proved he was actin on his own.
----continued----

miggidy · Feb 10, 2004

EDJ said:

You're givin me too much credit here, just because you have that ability it doesn't mean everyone else is as gifted as you.

Time after time, you let your ego get the best of you. You must humble that ego before you can soak anything up.
If anything gets through to you (And believe me, no pun intended. I am tryin to help you here.) it is that you really need to put a lock on your ego....

Say what you wanna say about my assumptions, I only assume when I have no alternative or when I do it purposely.

EDJ said:

No you're the only one making assumptions here.
It is a fact that everyone has friends and relatives who won't make it.
What? You disagree????

EDJ said:

Ok maybe I threw a jab at you, but you've been throwin haymakers at me the whole time, yet you don't see me taking offense.

EDJ said:

I already covered that above.
Your views lack consistancy, there is a double standard in your views....

EDJ said:

Isn't that how God tested Abraham's faith?
Well it was similar....

Oh yeah, Heaven is not a reward as Catholics and Jehova Wittnesses see it.

Now if I'm in that situation you just presented,
I don't know what I would do in that case. I guess I'd make it a last second decision. The way I look at it now, I don't think I would have the courage to kill my own son, even if I was aware of the consequences and was certain of them....

EDJ said:

Now we're getting there....

I wouldn't feel sorry for my son if he decided to ally himself with Satan. That is the path he chose, he knew right from wrong.
Yes it would hurt to know he's either being tortured or is gone for ever, it would hurt cuz he didn't obtain eternal life. But there was nothing I could do to save him, what else could I have done?
I tried everything to save him, yet he spear headed himself into hell....

This situation is similar to havin a gay son

EDJ said:

Like I already pointed out to, Heaven is not a reward as your JW people's see it. It is a privilege, and it's a privilege we're all hoping to obtain....

EDJ said:

Your lips keep movin but the same words keep comin out over and over. What difference does it make?

EDJ · Feb 10, 2004

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You either accept the scripture as it is without spining it, or you don't accept it all."

THAT'S THE THANg, WHAT IS SPINNIN' IT? HOW THE FUK YOU KNOW? HOW CAN YOU BE SO SURE THAT'S THE RIgHT WAY OF INTERPRETIN' SUCH SCRIPTURE? YOU DON'T.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You cannot stand in between with your own ideals..."

YOU CAN'T EITHA.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Your belief is heavily flawed and has no foundation EDJ,"

HOW'S THAT? THE SAME HAS BEEN SHOWED INSTEAD OF JUST EASILY SAID ABOUT YOU.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "it's time to humble your ego and accept reality bro...."

WHAT IS MY EgO, WHILE YOU TRYIN´TO JUDgE MUTHA-FUKAS? WHAT IS REALITY? HOW CAN YOU BE SO SURE?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "It's easy, you are fixated on your JW based ideals."

THAT'S YOUR #1 PROBLEM. YOU'RE THE ONE FIXATED ON LABELIN' WHAT I BELIEVE INSTEAD OF LOOKIN' AT WHAT I'M STRESSIN'. SINCE THE BEgINNIN' OF THIS THREAD YOU HAVE ASSUMED THAT I WAS LINKIN' YOU TO JEHOVAH'S WITNESS SITES AND SO FORTH, ARgUIN' AND FIgHTIN' ME LIKE I WAS A JEHOVAH'S WITNESS, CAUSE YOU'RE FIXXED ON THAT THOUgHT. I gUESS IF IT MAKES YOU FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE AND AT EASE TO TRY TO MAKE YOUR POINT BY LABELIN' WHAT I HOLD AS TRUTH, THEN IT IS WHAT IT IS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "But we can go that route again, (like we already haven't) it's fine with me...."

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE BABY MAMA DRAMA?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I agree, God's original plan for man was for us to reside on Earth but with eternal life. You seem to have forgotten that....?

NO, I´M THE ONE THAT BROUgHT THAT POINT UP. YOU SEEM LIKE YOU HAVE FORgOTTEN THAT, AS WELL AS MOST CHRISTIANS, CAUSE THEY BELIEVE HEAVEN TO BE THEIR DESTINATION AFTER DEATH.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Now you say God disciplines his children and you compare eternal death to a whoopin. Why whoop them if you can punish them without getting physical?"

YOU CAN EITHA OR. BUT EVEN THE BIBLE SPEAKS UP ON WHOOPINS WHEN LITTLE CHILDREN ARE BAD. BUT THAT'S A PERSONAL CHOICE HOW YOU DECIDE TO DISCIPLINE YOUR CHILDREN. SOME LEARN WHEN THEY´RE TOLD NOT TO TOUCH THE ELECTRIC SOCCET, SOME LEARN BY gETTIN' ELECTROCUTED AFTER THE FACT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You said it yourself, it's fucked up for God to torture his children, well with that logic it's also fucked up for him to deny his children their daily bread AKA life.... Where's your consistancy?"

WHERE'S YOUR "CONSISTENCY"? YOU TRYIN' TO TWIST IT TO WHERE (gOD) IS DENYIN' MUTHA'FUKAS LIFE AND THAT'S NOT 100% ACCURATE. I ALREADY EXPLAINED THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ETERNAL TORTURE AND BEIN' CUT OFF.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "LOL! I'm a fanatic for visually expressin what I believe in?
What am I shovin it down your throat?"

SOME WOULD SAY THAT. BUT HEY, IT'S YOUR PICTURE. THE THANg IS, HOW YOU KNOW IF JESUS LOOKED LIKE THAT? AND WHY YOU MAKIN' IT SEEM LIKE JESUS WAS A FIgHTER WHEN ALL HE TAUgHT WAS TO TURN THE OTHA CHEEK?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "LOL... A while back you said it was punishment, but yeah we reap what we sow yet it is he who Judges us."

QUOTE PLEASE. PUNISHMENT AS IN TORMENTIN´AND INFLICTIN´PAIN. WHY WOULD (gOD) DO THAT TO US? BUT OF COURSE HE JUDgES US AT THE END. RIgHT NOW HE IS NOTHIN´BUT A MERE OBSERVER.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "bible, you follow a theory originated by a man who claims he was inspired by God but time after time his actions proved he was actin on his own."

YOU gOT ME FUCCED UP. I FOLLOW NO MAN. WHAT THEORY DO I FOLLOW MR. KNOW-IT-ALL?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You're givin me too much credit here, just because you have that ability it doesn't mean everyone else is as gifted as you."

IT'S A FORM OF EXPRESSION YOU NASTY MUTHA-FUKA YOU. QUIT PUTTIN' YOUR OWN EgO AS #1 IS WHAT IS MEANT BY THAT(JUST IN CASE YOU AIN'T UP ON gAME).

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Time after time, you let your ego get the best of you. You must humble that ego before you can soak anything up."

WHAT A COINCIDENCE, I WAS SAYIN' THE SAME THANg ABOUT YOU WITH THAT "SUCCIN' YOUR OWN DIK" COMMENT. ON THE RILLA, QUIT COPYIN' WHAT I'M STRESSIN' AND TRYIN' TO FLIP THE SHIT ON ME.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "If anything gets through to you (And believe me, no pun intended. I am tryin to help you here.) it is that you really need to put a lock on your ego...."

SAME AS THE ABOVE. YOU THE ONE FROM JUMP THAT'S BEEN LIKE THAT. LOOK INTO WHAT I'M STRESSIN'.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Say what you wanna say about my assumptions, I only assume when I have no alternative or when I do it purposely."

EITHA OR, YOU SHOULDN'T BE LIKE THAT. BE WELL INFORMED BEFORE YOU START TO gETTIN' TO JUMP gUNS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "No you're the only one making assumptions here.
It is a fact that everyone has friends and relatives who won't make it.
What? You disagree????"

MAKE IT WHERE?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Ok maybe I threw a jab at you, but you've been throwin haymakers at me the whole time, yet you don't see me taking offense."

HAYMAKERS? LOL. I APOLOgIZE IF YOU HAVE TOOKEN MY WORDS AS SUCH. NOW I UNDA-STAND WHY YOU COMIN' LIKE YOU COMIN'.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Your views lack consistancy, there is a double standard in your views.... "

NOPE. YOU TRYIN' TO IMPLY A DOUBLE STANDARD BUT FAIL. AgAIN, YOUR FRAME OF THINKIN' HAS BLINDED YOU. THERE AIN'T NO DOUBLE STANDARD.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Isn't that how God tested Abraham's faith?"

YOU COMPLETEY MISSED MY POINT. ABRAHAM'S FAITH AND LOYALTY WAS TESTED. IN MY ILLUSTRATION AND QUESTION IT WOULDN'T BE NO TEST BUT IT WOULD BE FAVORABLE TO YOU AND YOUR BELIEFS IF YOU WERE TO KILL YOUR SON CAUSE YOU WOULD WANT HIM IN HEAVEN WITH YOU. SO I QUESTIONED YOUR MORALITY.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Oh yeah, Heaven is not a reward as Catholics and Jehova Wittnesses see it."

WHO SAID IT WAS? AND FOR THE RECORD, YOU NEED TO DO MORE RESEARCH ON THE RELIgIONS YOU SPEAK ON, CAUSE I KNOW IT, JEHOVAH'S WITNESS DON'T LOOK AT HEAVEN AS A REWARD. AgAIN, YOU HAVE LET YOUR IgNORANCE SHOW BY BEIN' ASSUMPTIVE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Now if I'm in that situation you just presented,
I don't know what I would do in that case. I guess I'd make it a last second decision. The way I look at it now, I don't think I would have the courage to kill my own son, even if I was aware of the consequences and was certain of them...."

I HOPE YOU WOULDN'T KILL YOUR SON. THAT BE LUDICROUS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I wouldn't feel sorry for my son if he decided to ally himself with Satan. That is the path he chose, he knew right from wrong."

YES, BUT HE IS STILL YOUR SON REgARDLESS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Yes it would hurt to know he's either being tortured or is gone for ever, it would hurt cuz he didn't obtain eternal life."

TRUE, BUT KNOWIN' HE IS STILL CONSCIOUS SUFFERIN' IS WAY WORSE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "But there was nothing I could do to save him, what else could I have done?"

THAT'S BESIDE THE POINT. THE POINT IS, WOULD YOU RATHER BELIEVE YOUR SON IS UNCONSIOUS NOT SUFFERIN' NO MORE IN THIS FUCCED UP WORLD OR THAT HE'S IN A SUPER-NATURAL REALM BEIN' TORTURED DAY AND NIgHT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I tried everything to save him, yet he spear headed himself into hell...."

OH SO YOU WOULD RATHER BELIEVE HE'S BEIN' TORTURED? WHAT KIND OF MUTHA'FUCCIN' gOD DOES THAT? IF THAT WAS THE CASE, I WOULD BE LIKE, "WHY WOULD I WANNA BE UP IN HEAVEN WITH A HEARTLESS SON OF A BITCH THAT IS TORTURIN' MY CHILD?" FUK THAT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "This situation is similar to havin a gay son"

HOW WOULD YOU KNOW? LOL

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Like I already pointed out to, Heaven is not a reward as your JW people's see it. It is a privilege, and it's a privilege we're all hoping to obtain...."

IgNORANCE IS BLISS. JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES DON'T BELEIVE HEAVEN AS A REWARD. gET YOUR FACTS STRAIgHT. AND IF HEAVEN IS A PRIVILEDgE EVERYBODY IS HOPIN' TO OBTAIN THEN WHY IS WE ON THIS EARTH? WHY WERE WE EVEN PUT ON THIS EARTH? SO THE EARTH IS JUST SOME BULLSHIT NOW? (gOD) JUST CHANgED HIS ORIgINAL PLAN? THEN WHAT DOES THE EARTH BECOME ONCE EVERYBODY IS IN HEVEN OR HELL MR. gENIUS?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Your lips keep movin but the same words keep comin out over and over. What difference does it make?"

CORRECTION. MY MIND KEEPS THINKIN' AND FINgERS KEEP TYPIN'. BUT IF I 'M STRESSIN' THE SAME SHIT, THEN WHY IS IT HARD FOR YOU TO SEE WHAT I'M SAYIN' THEN?

EDJ · Feb 10, 2004

THIS MUTHA-FUCCIN' COMPUTER BULLSHIT. I HAD YOUR SHIT ALREADY AND SHIT MIggIDY BUT THIS MUTHA'FUKA LOggED ME OFF AND CUT HALF OF YOUR RESPONSES OUT. I´LL TRY AgAIN.

THIS THE FIRST PART:

YOU STRESSED, "No I don't skip the important things that are relevant to our convo.
But I do skip insignificant stuff, time is money....Speakin of time, I won't be in here as often as I used to (kind of like you).
Baby mama drama on mine, so I gotta focus on that for the time being.
"

DO WHAT YOU DO. HANDLE WHAT YOU gOT TO HANDLE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Erroneous info eh? How about your erroneous JW based belief of no eternal damnation?"

WHILE YOU HERE TRYIN' TO LABEL AND POINT FINgERS, YOU NEED TO gET YOUR FACTS STRAIgHT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "No different than the Mormon belief of reincarnation."

MORMONS BELIEVE IN REINCARNATION? I NEVA KNEW THAT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Say what you wanna say about where you stand but the "no hell" belief is only shared by you and JW's when it comes to those who read the bible."

SO YOU SAYIN' THAT I AgREE WITH WHAT THEY PRESENTIN'? I SAY IT MAKES PERFECT SENSE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Now you ask how is it that people have turned their back on their creator and allying with Satan; well that's simple.
Satan has a lot of influence over the negative things we do.
He has a clear pattern in the scripture with tryin to spoil God's children, for example Adam and Eve, the Nephilim, and so on."

IN YOUR WORDS, "THAT IS CHRISTIAN KINDERgARTEN".

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Satan has changed his strategy as of late, remaining unseen and pullin strings behind curtains.
People are allying with Satan left and right without even realizing it. Their minds have become currupt to the point that you even have lost souls worshipping Satan. Yes it's gotten that bad....
Those and many others are the people who are allying with Satan and turning their back on their creator...."

SO HOW CAN YOU BE SO SURE YOU AIN'T ONE OF THEM PEOPLE SATAN IS FOOLIN' WITHOUT REALIZIN' IT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You say that I'm stuck with the eternal torment issue and that I've yet to answer your question.
Hmmm.... The only one stuttering here is you, just look at your argument supporting your personal belief."

LOOK AT IT. BUT YOU HAVE YET TO TO SEE WHAT I'M STRESSIN'. YOU HAVE YET TO ANSWER MY QUESTION.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "And I've answered what ever question you're talking about."

OH YEAH? WHAT IS IT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I don't want God to punish anyone for eternity, I am not the Judge, he is."

WE KNOW THIS. THE QUESTION IS, WHAT IS THE DISCIPLINE HE USES?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "However I'm not the one in denial here, you are. You are in denial that such a loving God would torment his own children."

FIFTY FIRST OF ALL,
TO BE IN DENIAL, IS FOR SOMETHIN' TO BE FACTUAL AND YOU DENYIN' THAT IT'S REALITY AND A FACT.

XCONDLY,
YOUR BELIEF HAS FLAWS AS NOTED AND YOU HAVEN´T ANSWERED SUCH DOUBTS AND QUESTIONS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Yet you believe that this same loving God will not give his own children eternal life. How is it that one is worse than the other EDJ?"

I BELIEVE A CHANCE FOR A RESURECTION IS THERE. I BELIEVE THAT YOU WILL BE JUDgED. I DON'T HOWEVA BELIEVE THAT A LOVIN' FATHER WOULD TORMENT HIS OWN CHILDREN. THAT TYPE OF JUDgEMENT IS ILLOgICAL AND UNJUST.

BEIN' TORMENTED ETERNALLY IS FAR WORSE THAN JUST BEIN' CUT OFF ETERNALLY.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You gotta see your own logic here, it doesn't make any sense for Him to punish his children for ever by killing them for ever, just like you admitted. Killing them for ever is no different than tormenting them for ever because either way, they won't live for ever. Either way, they're still going to miss the boat.

HOW SO? PEOPLE MADE THE CHOICE OF NOT DOIN' (gOD'S) WILL. YOU MAKIN' IT SEEM LIKE (gOD)´S A MURDERER KILLIN' MUTHA-FUKAS. PEOPLE DIE AND WILL BE JUDgED WHEN THE RESURECCTION COMES. BUT AFTER THAT TO BE TORMENTED FOREVA IS NOT THE SAME AS JUST BEIN' CUT OFF FROM A RESURECTION OF LIFE. YOU CEASE TO EXIST AND THÁT'S THAT. BE TO BE CONSCIOUS AFTER THE FACT AND IN EXCRUCIATIN' PAIN? NOW THAT'S FAR WORSE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "How can this loving God do such a thing to his own children?
You say it's punishment but what kind of punishment is killin your own children and denying them eternal life????"

(gOD) JUDgES THOSE AND HE IS NOT KILLIN' THEM. HE gAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY. HE gAVE HIS ONLY BEgOTTEN SON AS RANSOM IT'S ON THEM IF THEY CHOOSE LIFE OR DEATH. OF COURSE HE WANTS EVERYBODY TO RECEIVE ETERNAL LIFE BUT NOT EVERYBODY WILL.

miggidy · Feb 11, 2004

EDJ said:

Who's the one making up a different interpretation of the scripture? The concept of hell is consistant through out the scripture, yet you some how managed to spin it with "your" own personal ideals.

EDJ said:

No, you and your Jehova Witnesses belief is only held by you and them. It is a cult following.
You have yet to show anything to back up your "no hell" belief other than your defiance to the idea.

EDJ said:

Denial is a symptom of an egotistical person.

I am not judging you, I'm only callin it like I see it. Yet you've been judgin me since this convo started, but you don't see me complaining about it do you?

Your ego comes across just about every time you type.
Your dislike for certain people, you wantin to take certain people out the game, you try to bring people down like you've attempted to do with me several times in this thread. That is your ego gettin the best of you....

EDJ said:

See what I mean?
You keep bringin up one simple and insignificant mistake I made just to discredit everything I've been sayin.
That shit ain't gonna work man, it might heal your ego.
It may help you deal with your own inner pain but it ain't gonna change anything outside of your little world.

You are fixated on one and many JW ideals. You say you believe in it, I call it fixation. Unlike you, I am open to new ideas.
How ever you have yet to show me anything supporting your "no hell" theory. If indeed you are familiar with the scripture, then you will realize that it speaks volumes against what you personally believe. You keep making these claims that "hell/hades" is early Christian dogma but that's flat out bullshit. Pick up the bible and read for yourself, hell/hades is an actual place/event. It is real and not just something made up as you claim.
Christians and Jews held this belief thousands of years before you did, there 's billions of people holding this belief. Versus a few million who share your belief which sprouted just over a century ago. The burden of proof is on YOU....

EDJ said:

It's a long story bro.
Basically we called it quits now I'll never get to see my little boy....

EDJ said:

No man, what I'm refferin to is that even though Heaven wasn't meant for us, we still had eternal life.
We lost that when Adam ate from the tree of knowledge and every since then people have been looking for a way to eternal life.

EDJ said:

Can you point me to the passage where it talks about whoopin your kids?

EDJ said:

That's what I meant above when I said that it seems to me like you forgot that when God created us, he gave us immortality.
You heard of the original sin right? It's the reason why we no longer have eternal life.
Ever since then, mankind has tried to find a way to obtain eternal life by any means. God has given us different routes to eternal life through out the years. But now it is through the Christ, by accepting him as the sacrificial lamb....
You're either going to go to heaven by way of the Great Tribulation or you will live forever when Jesus reins supreme.

You probably agree this far, but where we disagree is what happens to the dead. You believe those who obtained eternal life will be resurected while those who didn't make the cut will remain dead. Yet the scripture says that "all" will be resurected and then judged, those who make the cut will have a new and perfect body while everyone else will be thrown to hell for ever....

EDJ said:

Yeah some love to talk shit without bringin anything to the table, so who cares what they think right?

I don't know what Jesus looked like, that it is how we make him out of very little. There's the shroud, but it's not authentic. However it's a replica of the real deal. And that is where we get the picture as to what he looked like.

As far as Jesus being a fighter, well he said it himself, the first time he was a lamb, but he's coming back as a lion.

EDJ said:

It's in your previous post.
But I don't care, either way he judges us. He's gotta make a tough decision regardless. A decision a mortal man can't make when it comes to judgin the fate of his own son.

Why would God punish us with eternal pain? For the same reason you say he won't give everyone eternal life.

EDJ said:

I didn't say you follow anyone, I said you follow one man's theory. And you know which theory I'm refferin to.

Again, you're giving me too much credit. I believe only God knows it all....

EDJ said:

LOL!

EDJ said:

I said it first, what you said about me only applies to someone who is self centered.
LOL!
You copied me.
But go on, "yes yes EDJ, I copied you".
I'll give you all the credit you want man hahahaha....
---Continued---

miggidy · Feb 11, 2004

EDJ said:

I admit, I have an ego (who doesn't). I try my best to control it and not get the best of me.
I try real hard day after day.

EDJ said:

Come on, you have to make assumptions some times in order to move ahead. Otherwise, you'll be stuck in the same place. Of coarse I am talking about when there's no alternative.
I can explain myself further if you like but trust me on this one.

But keep in mind that some times people jump into cunclusions purposely to annoy the next man. I do it every now and then for a few laughs (that's my ego) but it's only for fun.

EDJ said:

Eternal life or heaven.

EDJ said:

Haymakers always miss their targets when you throw them at a foo he's been schooled in boxing.
So I ain't trippin, none landed LOL!

EDJ said:

There is, you know why?
It's what you forgot about. Did this hint help you?
Still don't know?
God's original plan was that we would never die....

EDJ said:

I answered your question didn't I?
You also tested my loyalty towards my own beliefs.

I see shit differently.... Some would say if I truly believed that my son would go to heaven then I shouldn't have trouble killin him.
But in my case, it isn't about faith. I know my son would go to heaven, but my love would keep me from killin him....

EDJ said:

Ok that was just ignorant.
Both of them see heaven as a reward, specially Jehova Witnesses. They believe salvation is achieved by puttin in works, am I wrong????
Oh.... You seem to have realized you just shot from the hip eh?
I don't care cuz I'm tryin to make a point here.
JW's go around puttin in work all the time, hopin they are chosen.
So what's the reward for puttin in this work????
Now you understand what I meant by reward?

EDJ said:

Yes it would be to our carnal minds.

EDJ said:

Yes, that will never change.

EDJ said:

Maybe, but I ain't God. I am merely a man.

EDJ said:

If you looked at it from face value, yes it is fucked up to know my son is suffering forever.
But when you look at it deeper, it doesn't make a difference. Eternal damnation and eternal death is the same. Either way, you missed the boat.

EDJ said:

It's not a matter of what I wanna believe or what I want to accept. It is what is and how it is.

EDJ said:

LOL Come on man, I guess I have a good imagination. But try to put yourself in the shoes of a parent who has a gay kid.
What can you do? This little fucker wants to go around stickin his pee pee in someone's poo poo.

FYI, my son is not gay neither am I LOL!
My son be checkin out fine females all the time.
Seein a toddler rubber neckin to a female is one of the funniest sites I've ever seen.

EDJ said:

LOL!
I already explained this earlier in this post.
So I'll skip the part of why JW's see heaven or eternal life as a reward.

And we already talked about why we were put on this Earth as well....

Has God changed his original plan? Only he knows. What I know is that we had immortality until Adam ate from the tree of knowledge. God has later created new ways for us to obtain eternal life.

What does the Earth become? The New Testiment says the Earth is where we will dwell for ever. Everything will be perfect as it was first meant to be.

EDJ said:

It aint that it's hard to understand what you are sayin, it's the lack of content behind what you are sayin, that's the problem.

Up until this point, you've only given me your "opinion" as to why you don't accept the Christian version of hell.
---continued---

miggidy · Feb 11, 2004

EDJ said:

I hate it when that shit happens, but I don't think it's your PC.
The fucken Siccness servers are always stalling.

EDJ said:

Ok?

EDJ said:

Actually, I don't even think they have a definate idea as to what happens after death.

EDJ said:

Yes and I also say that it is just you and them that hold this belief.
While everyone else thinks differently....
Time after time you have pointed out that this is just an early church doctrine and that's it's some how made up by the church.
But that ain't the case man, cuz people still believed in hell even after the church reformation. If what you believe was actually true, Martin Luther would've also rebuked the idea of hell as well.
So you cannot say that the concept of hell is just some med evil early Catholic church dogma.

EDJ said:

Exactly, now why is that you asked such a kindergarten level question?
Be honest, I am not implying that it's because you didn't know.
I know you knew but yet you asked me?
I want an honest answer....

EDJ said:

Because up until a year ago, I was one of his puppets.
Check out the second track on my sig.
Peep out "Demons in Da Dark"....
That was the old me, with him beside me.
He is now gone and this is the new me....

It took me a long ass time before I realized I was being manipulated. You know why I didn't realize it for so long?
Because I didn't believe in him.... I didn't even know the fucker existed....
I owe it all to God for openning my eyes....
Actually, I'm very fortunate that I even listenned to him (God).
Don't mean to get side tracked here, but I believe God gives everyone a final chance. That final chance comes in different ways. With me it was one way, but I've seen him communicate with other people as well. I can see it but yet these people can't. Follow what I'm sayin?
People ignore him all the time and give him the cold shoulder. If only peoeple changed the way they look at the world. Only then would they realize the truth....
You gotta tune into his frequency....

EDJ said:

I see wat you're stressin but I don't know what the question is.
That is if in case I missed it but I have answered all your questions thus far (to my knowledge).

EDJ said:

You mean punishment right?
Discipline is only temporary and it comes before punishment.

You believe that the discipline/punishment is eternal death.
I believe it's eternal punishment.
We already covered the reasons behind our differences so I'll move on....

EDJ said:

That is the whole point as to why you are in denial.
You deny facts. Read the scripture over and over until it soaks into your head.
It's in the scripture time and time again, both Jesus talked about it and so did his disciples. I'd much rather take their word for it over anyone elses. Specially over someone who's in the minority with absolutely no foundation.

You have yet to show any flaws in "our" Christian concept of hell.
All you have shown is personal beefs....

EDJ said:

That is the problem bro, you're tryin to reason something that is beyond you. Who are we to judge Him?
We our limited in our knowledge and comprehension....

EDJ said:

Let me get this straight, you believe these people will be resurected only to be put back to death????

EDJ said:

The same can be said for hell.

There has got to be a place for our souls....

Peace bro....

HERESY · Feb 11, 2004

"Let me get this straight, you believe these people will be resurected only to be put back to death????"

LOL!

I HATE TO KILL THIS THREAD BUT SERIOUSLY..............IF YOU WANT REAL PRODUCTION HIT MY SOUNDCLICK PAGE. IT CAN BE FOUND IN MY SIG OR IN MY PROFILE.

:HGK:

EDJ · Feb 11, 2004

HERESY,
I HAD YOUR RESPONSE BEFORE I ANSWERED MIggIDY BUT THE PUNK ASS LIBRARY COMPUTER FUCCED IT OFF AND THAT'S WHY MIggIDY HAD A HALF A RESPONSE, CAUSE YOUR RESPONSE AND HIS INITIAL RESPONSE DIDN'T gO THRU CAUSE IT WAS HALF COPIED(CONTROL+C) CAUSE THE WORD LIMIT. THEN THE PUNK ASS SITE LOggED ME OFF AND I COULDN'T RETRIEVE SHIT BUT WHAT I COPIED.

N-E-WAY, WHAT I STRESSED BEFORE THAT BULLSHIT AND AFTER I WAS JUST ANgRY, WAS THAT I WAS gONNA ANSWER ALL YOUR SHIT BUT WE HOLLARED ON THE PHEEZY. SO I KNOW WE CAN'T HOLLA BOUT THIS RELIgION SHIT CAUSE IT TAKES UP TIME AND HAVE US CONFLICTIN' FOR NATHAN.
BUT I DO WANT TO ADDRESS A FEW POINTS YOU MADE.

YOU STRESSED, "You follow the J.W. dogma/doctrine. Not only that but you contradict yourself. You *imply* that god does have to judge and discipline his people. Later on you say he gives them a chance or they get cut off but after that you say god does NOT punish. If god does NOT punish why are people cut off? Doesn't a judge or parent punish?

MAN, I FOLLOW NO MAN. PLUS THE JEHOVAH'S WITNESS IS NOT A DOCTRINE OR DOgMA. THEY'RE AN ORgANIZATION. BUT WHAT I MEAN BY PUNISH, IS TO TORMENT. (gOD) DON'T TORMENT. HE ANNHILIATES. WHAT PURPOSE DOES TORMENTIN' SERVE?

EDJ · Feb 11, 2004

MIggIDY,
YOU STRESSED, "Who's the one making up a different interpretation of the scripture?"

YOU ACT LIKE EVERYBODY READS IT THIS WAY AND SO SHOULD I. I LOOK FOR THE HEBREW AND gREEK WORDS USED AND THEN SEE IF THE INTERPRETATION RENDERED WOULD CONTRADICT OTHA PASSAgES AND HOW SO, AND SO FORTH.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "The concept of hell is consistant through out the scripture, yet you some how managed to spin it with "your" own personal ideals."

BULLSHIT. THE CONCEPT OF HELL CONTRADICTS OTHA BIBLE PASSAgES. I PROVIDED IN OTHA EARLIER PAgES INFO. I SUggEST YOU gO BAK, OBSERVE, MARINATE, AND MEDITATE OVER THE PASSAgES gIVEN.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "No, you and your Jehova Witnesses belief is only held by you and them."

QUITE A gENERALIZED AND LABELED COMMENT. WHY CAN'T MY THOUgHT'S BE MY THOUgHT'S AND YOU QUESTION MY LOgIC WITHOUT BRINgIN' THE JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES INTO IT? JUST LIKE YOUR BIAS ASSUMPTION THAT I LINKED YOU TO A JEHOVAH'S WITNESS SITE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "It is a cult following."

BULLSHIT. IT IS LABELED BY SOME(LIKE YOURSELF) AS ONE, BUT IF YOU REALLY TOOK THE TIME TO SEE WHAT THEY ARE YOU WOULD KNOW THEY DIFFER FROM THE ALIEN-WAITIN'-TO-TAKE-THEM-FROM-EARTH-WACCO'S AND THEM OTHA SECTIONED OFF CULTS.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Denial is a symptom of an egotistical person."

DENIAL IS A SYMPTOM OF N-E PERSON THAT KNOWS HE/SHE IS WRONg BUT WON'T ADMIT IT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I am not judging you, I'm only callin it like I see it."

WHAT DO YOU SEE?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Yet you've been judgin me since this convo started, but you don't see me complaining about it do you?"

HOW AM I JUDgIN' YOU? YOU THE ONE THAT STARTED BEIN' BIAS AND ASSUMPTIVE AND ALL I WANTED WAS TO CHOP IT UP.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Your ego comes across just about every time you type.
Your dislike for certain people, you wantin to take certain people out the game, you try to bring people down like you've attempted to do with me several times in this thread. That is your ego gettin the best of you...."

NO, THAT IS YOU TRYIN' TO JUDgE ME AND HAVE THAT ASSUMPTIVE BEHAVIOR. WHO DO I DISLIKE? WHO HAVE I BROUgHT DOWN? HOW HAVE I ATTEMPTED TO BRINg YOU DOWN?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "See what I mean?
You keep bringin up one simple and insignificant mistake I made just to discredit everything I've been sayin."

FIFTY-FIRST OF ALL,
NO, I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN.

XCONDLY,
THE MISTAKE WAS NOT INSIgNIFICANT. MATTER OF FACT, I FEEL IT WASN'T A MISTAKE LIKE YOU PORTRAY IT TO BE BUT A BIAS ATTITUDE THAT IMPEDES YOU FROM SEEIN' WHAT I'M STRESSIN'. THAT SET THE TEMPO UP AND LET ME KNOW WHERE YOUR HEAD WAS AT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "That shit ain't gonna work man, it might heal your ego."

NO, YOUR SHIT AIN'T gONNA WORK. DON'T TRY TO TWIST IT ON ME NOW.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "It may help you deal with your own inner pain but it ain't gonna change anything outside of your little world."

WHAT ARE YOU EVEN TALKIN' BOUT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You are fixated on one and many JW ideals. You say you believe in it, I call it fixation. Unlike you, I am open to new ideas."

FIFTY FIRST OF ALL,
THEY AIN'T THEY IDEALS. THEY'RE TRUTHS. THEY WERE PRESENTED, BACCED UP, RESEARCHED AND AKNOWLEDgED.

XCONDLY,
UNLIKE YOU, WHO SEEMS CONFUSED AT TIMES, NOBODY CAN JUST RUN UP ON ME AND SPIT THEY gAME AND DEVIATE ME FROM TRUTH. ONCE YOU KNOW TRUTH, YOU RECOgNIZE LIES.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "How ever you have yet to show me anything supporting your "no hell" theory."

I SUggEST YOU gO BAK A FEW PAgES AND SEE ALL THE SCRIPTURES I BROUgHT TO YOUR ATTENTION. LOOK AT THE HEBREW AND gREEK WORDS THE WORD HELL WAS RENDERED FROM AND SEE IN WHAT CONTEXT THEY ARE USED. AND BY THE WAY, WHAT I BELIEVE IS NOT A THEORY, ESPECIALLY ONE THAT DEVISED.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "If indeed you are familiar with the scripture, then you will realize that it speaks volumes against what you personally believe."

IN YOUR KINg JAMES FLAWED AND BIAS SCRIPTURES. DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHO WAS ON HIS COMMITTEE WHEN HE DECIDED TO MAKE HIS OWN BIBLE?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You keep making these claims that "hell/hades" is early Christian dogma but that's flat out bullshit. Pick up the bible and read for yourself, hell/hades is an actual place/event. It is real and not just something made up as you claim."

I HAVE. THE WORDS SHEOL AND gEHENNA HAVE BEEN MISCONSTRUED. PRIESTS WERE THE ONLY ONES THAT KNEW WHAT THE BIBLE SAID AND USED IT TO CONTROL THE MASSES. IF RENDERED RIgHT, HELL IS YOUR gRAVE. DO YOUR RESEARCH.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Christians and Jews held this belief thousands of years before you did, there 's billions of people holding this belief. Versus a few million who share your belief which sprouted just over a century ago. The burden of proof is on YOU...."

BE A PUPPET AND FOLLOW THE MASSES. YOU HEARD OF THE TWO PATHS IN THE BOOK OF MATHEW? WHAT DOES IT SAY? WHO'S IN THE BROAD AND WHO'S IN THE NARROW?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "It's a long story bro.
Basically we called it quits now I'll never get to see my little boy...."

SO I gUESS YOU HAVE TIME TO JUST BE ON THE SICCNESS NOW?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "No man, what I'm refferin to is that even though Heaven wasn't meant for us, we still had eternal life.
We lost that when Adam ate from the tree of knowledge and every since then people have been looking for a way to eternal life."

I KNOW THIS BUT JESUS'S RANSOM IS ANOTHA OPPORTUNITY. BUT HEAVEN AIN'T THE PLACE WERE THE RIgHTEOUS AND MEEK WILL BE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Can you point me to the passage where it talks about whoopin your kids?"

I'LL gET BAK AT YOU WITH IT CAUSE I AIN'T gOT THAT MUTHA-FUKA MEMORIZED. I REMEMBER POPS USED TO ALWAYS RECITE THAT PASSAgE BEFORE HE WHOOPED OUR ASS. BUT IT SAID SOMETHIN' ALONg THE LINES THAT LET THE STIK BE STIFF SO YOUR CHILD WON'T DEVIATE OR SAMETHIN' LIKE THAT. BUT DON'T TELL ME YOU BELIEVE IN THAT TIME-OUT SHIT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "That's what I meant above when I said that it seems to me like you forgot that when God created us, he gave us immortality.
You heard of the original sin right? It's the reason why we no longer have eternal life.
Ever since then, mankind has tried to find a way to obtain eternal life by any means. God has given us different routes to eternal life through out the years. But now it is through the Christ, by accepting him as the sacrificial lamb...."

BEFORE CHRIST THERE WAS NO WAY. ADAM FUCCED IT UP FOR ALL OF US.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You're either going to go to heaven by way of the Great Tribulation or you will live forever when Jesus reins supreme."

HOW'S THAT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "You probably agree this far, but where we disagree is what happens to the dead. You believe those who obtained eternal life will be resurected while those who didn't make the cut will remain dead."

EXACTLY.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Yet the scripture says that "all" will be resurected and then judged, those who make the cut will have a new and perfect body while everyone else will be thrown to hell for ever...."

THAT REMAINS TO BE SEEN.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I don't know what Jesus looked like, that it is how we make him out of very little. There's the shroud, but it's not authentic. However it's a replica of the real deal. And that is where we get the picture as to what he looked like."

IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT JESUS LOOKED LIKE THEN WHY PROMOTE A CARTOON THAT'S INNACURATE?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "As far as Jesus being a fighter, well he said it himself, the first time he was a lamb, but he's coming back as a lion."

SCRIPTURE PLEASE.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "It's in your previous post."

QUOTE IT THEN. POINT ME TO IT. JUST DON'T SAY IT.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Why would God punish us with eternal pain? For the same reason you say he won't give everyone eternal life."

THAT DON'T MAKE SENSE. IT'S NOT LOgICAL OR JUST.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "I didn't say you follow anyone, I said you follow one man's theory. And you know which theory I'm refferin to."

ONE MAN IS REFERRIN' TO SOMEONE. AND WHAT IS THIS THEORY YOU BOLDY SPEAK OF?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Again, you're giving me too much credit. I believe only God knows it all...."

AND YOU JUST KNOW MORE THAN OTHAS, RIgHT?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Come on, you have to make assumptions some times in order to move ahead. Otherwise, you'll be stuck in the same place. Of coarse I am talking about when there's no alternative.
I can explain myself further if you like but trust me on this one."

DO IT. BUT ASSUMPTIONS SHOULDN'T BE MADE ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU'RE NOT WELL-INFORMED.

THEN YOU STRESSED, "But keep in mind that some times people jump into cunclusions purposely to annoy the next man. I do it every now and then for a few laughs (that's my ego) but it's only for fun."

I DON'T. I MAKE SHO' I KNOW WHAT I'M TALKIN' BOUT(MOST OF THE TIME).

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Eternal life or heaven."

SO YOU'RE NOT SURE NOW?

THEN YOU STRESSED, "Haymakers always miss their targets when you throw them at a foo he's been schooled in boxing.
So I ain't trippin, none landed LOL!"

TALK ABOUT EgO'S. gAAAAAAAWWWDAAAAMN!

THEN YOU STRESSED, "There is, you know why?
It's what you forgot about. Did this hint help you?
Still don't know?
God's original plan was that we would never die...."

I KNOW THIS.

TO BE CONTINUED..............

Derek J · Feb 11, 2004

miggidy said:

This might be off topic; but, personally, I'd rather be dead forever than tortured for eternity. LOL

Originally posted by miggidy I follow the bible, you follow a theory originated by a man who claims he was inspired by God but time after time his actions proved he was actin on his own.

Click to expand...

Once again, going from what I hear, the JW religion was kicked off by some dude because he rekindled the study of the Bible (I believe they went by "Bible Students" at first). However, the founder started making predictions about the end of the world based on certain prophesies, and continually embarassed himself. But, I don't think most JW's treat him like the Pope or anything. Thus, the theory they follow is technically The Bible.

In my personal experience growing up Catholic and more recently associating with JW's and Baptists, there are no real differences in their core beliefs. JW's don't believe in an eternal Hell or getting blood transfusions, Catholics do their ceremonies and saint worship, etc. However, they all follow the basic beliefs put forth in the Bible, and I honestly can't see and Christian faith being considered "better" than any other.

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