"Not In Our Name" statement signed by Mos Def, Boots of the Coup, others

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Apr 25, 2002
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#81
SHEA said:

YES....COMMUNISIM IS GREAT AINT IT??
I BET FIDEL WOULD WELCOME AMERICANS WITH OPEN ARMS...WRONG!


I GUESS THE REASON EVERYONE WANTS TO GET THE FUCK OUT THIER COUNRTY & COME TO THE USA IS CAUSE THIER COUNTRIES ARE SO GREAT RIGHT???? WRONG!!!

THINK ABOUT IT....THERE AINT NO SUCH THING AS AN AMERICAN REFUGEE LEAVING THE USA ON A SMALL ASS BOAT, CAUSE THE GOVERNMENT WONT LET THEM GO....IN CUBA, & COUNTRIES LIKE THAT,.....THEY ARE LEAVING EVERY DAY. SO I DONT HAVE TO GO THERE TO KNOW IT IS SHIT....REMEMBER THAT LITTLE REFUGEE KID A YEAR OR SO AGO...ALL THE PEOPLE IN FLORIDA WANTED HIM TO STAY, CAUSE THEY KNEW HOW FIDEL CASTRO IS- SO, YES...I'M SURE IT IS A GREAT PLACE TO BE

SS

Ok this reply was obviously filled with a lot of fact :rolleyes:

I’ll help you out Shea and lace you with some information on the subject so you won’t make yourself look so bad next time you try and speak on Cuba.

First Cuba has not attained communism, plain and simple. Socialism, maybe but that is even debatable. But not communism.

Second Fidel and the Cuban people welcome U.S. citizens to their country all the time. The restrictions on travel to Cuba are placed upon U.S. citizens by the U.S. government not by the people of Cuba. Jimmy Carter, Oliver Stone, Kevin Costner, many many U.S. senators and congressmen and women, Common and several other hip-hop artists, myself, and I could go on and on, have all been the guests of the Cuban people in their country and welcomed with open arms. But since you’ve been there I’m sure you’re an expert on how welcome the people of the U.S. really are.

Continuing with the subject of travel restrictions imposed upon the U.S. people by the U.S. government: Restrictions on travel to Cuba violate First and Fifth Amendments

“In February of this year, the Senate held hearings on travel restrictions to Cuba. At the end of the sessions, members of both the Senate Committee on Appropriations and the Treasury Subcommittee concluded three things: one, travel restrictions to Cuba have weakened Americans’ civil liberties without reinforcing national security; two, enforcement of the travel ban by the Treasury Department violates the U.S. Constitution by imposing draconian measures against U.S. citizens who exercise their “inalienable” rights to freedom of movement and speech; and finally, enforcement efforts are being strengthened at a time when government resources are desperately needed for the war on terrorism.”

“The Fifth Amendment guarantees freedom of movement, considered by the U.S. Supreme Court as the very “essence of a free society.” The court emphasized that “freedom of movement makes other rights more meaningful: knowing, studying, arguing, exploring, conversing, observing and even thinking. Once the right to travel is curtailed, all other rights suffer.”

The court also pointed out the effects of the travel ban on First Amendment freedom of speech: “Travel restrictions limit rights under the First Amendment to express our views, hear the speech of others, gather information and associate with others, rights that are essential in a democratic society.”

Justice William Douglas explained: “The right to know, to converse with others, to consult with them, to observe social, physical, political and other phenomena abroad, as well as at home, gives meaning to the substance of freedom of expression and freedom of the press. Without those contacts, First Amendment rights suffer.”

In fact, four out of nine Supreme Court justices have come out against the travel ban, stating that it defies the very principles the U.S. was founded upon.”

It should be noted, however, that during the cold war U.S. citizens were free to travel to the USSR, despite the fact that Moscow was considered the most serious threat to U.S. national security.

The Senate hearings point out that U.S. policy towards Cuba, in preventing Americans’ from exercising their First and Fifth Amendment rights, supposedly guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution, is illegal and, in fact, mirrors your very criticisms of Cuba.

And what about the people of the United States? Opinion polls by both CNN and Florida International University report that over 85% of Americans would like to see sanctions against Cuba lifted.

So everyone in Cuba wants to leave huh? I suppose you have proof of this right? Even many people that disagree with the government in Cuba don’t want to leave. Because they don’t take a defeatist attitude that Miami Cubans did or that you suggest people in this country take, “if you don’t like it leave”.

Their government, unlike that in the U.S., does not prevent people from leaving that do decide to do so. And in fact these people are forced by the U.S. governement and the powerful Cuban-American terrorist lobby to take these unsafe craft for their voyage to the U.S. If the U.S. government or the powerful Cuba-American lobby were concerned with the well fair of these people and in seeing them on a safe voyage to the U.S. then they would provide for safe travel for them. But how much anti-Cuba publicity would that stir up? “Well today 2 Cubans flew from Havana to Miami on a 747 and landed safely.” Its much more important for their propaganda to show people on these boats trying to leave. Provide them with safe travel and they’d take it.

As for Elian, the people that kidnapped him and held him from his father had no interest in that little boy’s life or well being what so ever. They are known terrorists and were using him as a propaganda tool against Cuba. “Terrorists you say CB?” Yes TERRORISTS! “But CB where is your proof?”
 
Apr 25, 2002
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#82
Terrorists continued . . . .

A living example of the extent of this criminal tolerance is Orlando Bosch, the pediatrician of death, anti-Cuba arch-terrorist, protected by the Bush family, the Cuban American National Foundation (CANF) and the CIA. The brains, together with Luis Posada Carriles, behind the sabotage of a Cubana airliner in full flight, provoking the death of 73 passengers on October 6, 1976, killer Bosch is now personally represented in the White House by his lifetime buddy Otto Reich, who sprung him from a Venezuelan jail.

On September 16, 1968, Bosch was involved in firing a projectile from bazooka on the Polish vessel Polanica, which was then docked in the port of Miami. On November 15, 1968, Bosch was convicted in the District Court for the Southern District of Florida of various felony offenses arising out of the assault on the Polish vessel. At that time he was also convicted on an indictment that had charged him with using the telegraph to send letters to the president of Mexico, General Francisco Franco of Spain; and British Prime Minister Harold Wilson, threatening to damage and destroy their countries’ ships and airplanes.

Bosch was paroled in 1972 and left the United States in 1974, thereby violating the terms of his parole.

More obsessed than ever with his terrorist mission, Bosch created and headed the Command of United Revolutionary Organizations (CORU) which, according to Whitley’s dossier, claimed responsibility for numerous bombings in Miami, New York, Venezuela, Panama, Mexico, Argentina and elsewhere.

Cuban American National Foundation (CANF), the main organization of the "anti-Cuba industry." From Jorge Mas Santos to Joe García, all the leading elements of the principal Cuban-American annexation-terrorist. It’s interesting to note that for decades now, the CANF has financed Luis Posada Carriles, who shares with Orlando Bosch the title of the most dangerous terrorist in the hemisphere. Posada Carriles masterminded the bombing of a Cubana Airlines plane in which all 73 people on board died; he is also responsible for more than 50 other attacks, including those that took place in Havana in 1997. In an interview with The New York Times, he confessed that for many years he has been able to count on the CANF’s unfailing economic support.

Other "experts" proven to have received money for terror (and above all from the network of Posada Carriles and Orlando Bosch): Roberto Martín Peréz (also a participant in plans for bombing attacks), Elpidio Núñez, Diego Rolando Suárez Muñoz and Felipe Vals Brau.

At a short distance from the CANF troops, the former capos of the CANF’s most fanatical wing, ecstatic with beatitude; they are now "dissidents" joined together in an organization pompously christened the Council for Cuban Liberty. Ninoska Pérez-Castillón (spokeswoman for the group and promoter of support for Posada Carriles), Alberto Hernández (former CANF president), Feliciano Foyo (whom Posada Carriles calls his "financier"), and Horacio García. Many of them signed a call to terrorism published by the Miami Herald in August 2001, in which they coldly affirmed that all means, however violent, are admissible to change the island’s government. The document was also signed by Miami terrorist leader Orlando Bosch, accomplice of Luis Posada Carriles and defender of the principle that it’s "normal" for innocent people to die in any confrontation.

Félix Rodriguez, one of the Watergate burglars and the head of the drug operation in El Salvador’s Ilopango base that allowed the Nicaraguan contras to buy arms, financed by cocaine sales on U.S. territory. A buddy of George Bush I and Otto Reich, both of whom covered up his activities, Rodriguez was closely linked to terrorist activities by secret organization Omega-7, responsible for several attacks and assassinations.

Huber Matos, head of Independent Democratic Cuba, who "distinguished" himself in the dirty war in Nicaragua.

Armando Pérez Roura, a Batista follower, Alpha 66 member, leader of the terrorist group Cuban Unity, involved in various criminal activities in Miami, hysterical announcer on a well-known terrorist radio station. Over the years Alpha 66, led by Nazario Sargent, has instigated and organized many terrorist raids on Cuba (all of which failed). In Miami, he continues to openly advocate the absolute need for violent actions without any interference by the authorities. His son also trafficked drugs.

Killers Dionisio Suárez Esquivel and Virgilio Paz Romero. The two men were freed by President Bush in August 2001 (just before the September 11 attacks), after being imprisoned for the murders of Chilean Ambassador Orlando Letelier and human rights activist Ronnie Moffit on a Washington DC street! This horrendous crime was denounced throughout the entire world.

Roberto Rodríguez de Aragón of the Cuban Patriotic Junta, godfather of various violent actions, alongside Sisto Reinaldo Aquis Manríquez and his crony Eugenio Llameras Rondón, both members of the Secret Army and Commandos L, and with abundant antecedents of participating in acts of terrorism.

Pedro Remón — as the FBI’s own files confirm — killed Félix García Rodríguez, a Cuban diplomat at the United Nations in New York, in September 1980. In November 1979, he also murdered Eulalio José Negrín, a Cuban-American who supported the island’s government, in front of his 12-year-old son. He has participated in broad range of terrorist crimes.

Guillermo Novo Sampoli has maintained an extensive history of terror for the last 40 years. Accomplice in the assassinations of Orlando Letelier and Ronnie Moffit, he was arrested in Miami carrying half a kilo of cocaine. He was finally found guilty of the double murder, but was "absolved" on appeal, thanks to legal shenanigans by the CIA, whose director at the time was George Bush I.

Gaspar Jiménez Escobedo, old conspirator buddy of Orlando Bosch, was involved in the savage murder of Cuban technician D’Artagnan Díaz Díaz in Mérida, Mexico, and later escaped from jail there. He took part in various other assassination attempts on the Cuban president in Jamaica, Mexico, Spain, Honduras, Colombia, Argentina and the Dominican Republic.

He likewise collaborated in the sinister Panama conspiracy, along with Nelsy Ignacio Castro Matos, Santiago Alvarez Fernández and Rubén Darío López Castro. All live in Miami and all are "eminent" personalities in the community of professional terrorists who, one supposes, are fully documented by the FBI.

It’s worth asking: How much longer will the U.S. people put up with a president held hostage by a handful of mafia terrorists? How much longer will the U.S. people put up with a shameless gang of criminals directing their nation’s foreign policy on Latin America? How much longer will the U.S. people put up with the cruel punishment meted out to five Cuban patriots who were imprisoned for counteracting terror?

Maybe its something you are willing to put up with Shea, but I’m not!
 

Roxy

Sicc OG
May 2, 2002
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#83
I think it was already stated that other countries are no paradise. The subject matter is getting confused. Every country is jacked. All governments leave much to be desired. Immigrants come to the US not so much for the government but for $$$$$$. Only the rich have time to stress about politics, b/c the poor are too busy w/ basic shit, like food, shelter and clothing. It isn't immigrants that are complaning about the government (ok on this board yes, but in the US as a whole, no), its natural born citizens that don't agree w/ THEIR OWN GOVERNMENTS' POLICIES. The immigrants are too scared to say anything b/c now they just might be considered enemies of the state. This whole thing is reminding me of the Vietnam War.

Fidel does welcome Americans w/ open arms, b/c they have American cash. He gives a fuck about where U come from as long as the cash is green and dead American presidents are on it. See, Fidel/ Cuba still has the poor person's mentality, survival is first w/ self-righteousness rounding up a distant second.
 

Roxy

Sicc OG
May 2, 2002
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#84
Thank U Cold, didn't see that before I posted.

Mr. Freeze U can have your opinion and we can have ours, that part of the beauty of living in the US. It's just interesting that when confronted w/ fact U take the cheap way out and say fuck this thread.

I know I will get shit for this but, oh well. Yeah 3,000 INNOCENT people died, that sucks. But stop geting hung up on that shit, b/c that # pales in comparison to the # of INNOCENT people that the US government has killed (or has helped to kill) all around the world. No one is crying boohoo for those INNOCENT people and their families. What is being experienced now by the American people is a taste of what your government has been inflicting on other since the begining. If U want to blame someone for 9/11 don't just blame the Osama and his clan but look deeper. What brought about that attack? Look at your government b/c they are the real killers, and just like cowards they are looking for someone else to take the blame for their faultiness. It's all propaganda. Remember people U reap what U sow, and payback is a BITCH.
 
Apr 25, 2002
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#85
MrFreeze said:
blah blah blah the us sucks and everywhere else is so much better. bullshit! im sick of this pointless debate. you can say love it or leave it is a lame argument but its better than putting our own country down and sayin were wrong even though they crashed planes full of innocent people into our buildings and killed 3000. seriously FUCK THIS THREAD!

THIS GOVERNMENT KILLED MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF NATIVE PEOPLE , KILLED THEM , BOOZED THEM UP , FORCED THEM ON RESERVATIONS , SO AFTER SO MANY GENERATIONS, A RESERVATION WITH NO HOPE WILL BE THE ONLY THING THEY'LL KNOW ......... SO FUCK AMERICA
 
Apr 25, 2002
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#87
YOuNg WiNo said:



THIS GOVERNMENT KILLED MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF NATIVE PEOPLE , KILLED THEM , BOOZED THEM UP , FORCED THEM ON RESERVATIONS , SO AFTER SO MANY GENERATIONS, A RESERVATION WITH NO HOPE WILL BE THE ONLY THING THEY'LL KNOW ......... SO FUCK AMERICA
Fuck the government, not America cuzzin. The rulers keep trying to convince us that THEY are "America." But they're nothing. They aren't the masses, they don't do the labor of this country, most of em don't even pay the taxes. WE are America, and we have to stop letting these capitalists, racists, and parasites run OUR country.
 
May 9, 2002
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#88
@Everybody that got offended by the comments I made on my last post:


I admit that cussin around and referrin to some of the people on this board as RACIST/FLAG WAVIN....Blah blah blah , was really out of place.. especially in such a discussion in which i was participatin quite objectively (for the most part) and Im not the type to start runnin my mouth cuz i feel safe behind a computer cuz that is just childish and cowardly!


That one post about having the right to nuke all those ''Fuckers'' in the Middle East(Basically the population of a whole continent) as retaliation for the crimes of one particular organization was just too much for me..so I just got too mad to continue with an healthy discussion

And as far as my ''Personal Beef''
If yall understood the history of me and my family u would never accuse us of bein jealous or ''Unloyal'' because we ''jumped ship''....Trust me if u live in a place where half ur family is being held behind bars without being criminals and the other half about to be executed , You too wouldnt think twice about leavin asap plus my native country was and is more or less still serving the purpose of a colony for the West(helping themto maintain that ''Western'' lifestyle and therefore increasingly suffering in all aspects) and im not gonna elaborate any further on my personal situation cuz this is the internet ...nothing more or less

But my opinions about the US Government being the root of all evil in these modern times because of their arrogance,extreme power and imperialistic methods of helping the rich and abusing the poor will never change ....Its not like America is the first Manifestation of an evil ruthless empire with nothing but material gain and oppression of the weak as the their main objective ...Mankind had to endure the Nazis...the British Colonists...and so many others before them that were not better in any form...Humans are the cruelest animals


So like yall posted befrore , the American people could not be that evil and cruel .....especially if a culture like Hip Hop was born and raised in yall country,what is American anyway?Natives? America is a country of immigrants and the greatest melting pot on earth so i cant understand that national pride some people have since they only inhabit that country and have their roots in totally different regions of the world!


Enjoy the extraordinary comfort and wealth that u have in your country.......but not at the expense of others, and if u do at least acknowledge this injustice and dont follow your racist imperialistic elite which only makes up about 5% of the people ...cuz these people are the closest thing to devils on our earth


PEACE



and I MEAN THAT
 
M

MrFreeze

Guest
#89
i feel where your commin from and i respect your opinion. well leave it at that playa. no hard feelings. stay up and 1-luv.
 
May 9, 2002
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#90
Thats Beautiful Mr Freeze

1 Luv

I just think that anyone should try to get a lil neutral information about the US Govmnts foreign policy before making statements in such discussions

Me, I had no choice Cuz my Life's been determined by pilitics for the most part..whateva

Peace Homie
 

PLOT

Sicc OG
Apr 25, 2002
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#94
"Enjoy the extraordinary comfort and wealth that u have in your country.......but not at the expense of others, and if u do at least acknowledge this injustice and dont follow your racist imperialistic elite which only makes up about 5% of the people ...cuz these people are the closest thing to devils on our earth"


Please like there isn't the same wealth and comfort in Europe. You come out of left field like you are the saint talking to the devil. Europe has cause more death and destruction than anywhere, but I'm not even going to go into that. Why are people so bitter? No matter who it is, in sports, buisness, whatever, people will always criticize and riducule whoever is in the #1 slot. So negative to only look at the bad aside from the good. REALITY CHECK...... 10%- 20% of ALL PEOPLE are crooked in one way or another. Be it police, the church, your family members, the government, sports teams, corporations, ect. If all you EVER focus on is the negative, that is ALL you will percieve.
Look at the police and the media, when was the last time you saw a segment on a good deed a cop did? A few months ago? Can't even remember? Yet almost every other night there's a "Officer involved shooting" or any number of other negative things. the good to the bad is outnumbered 10:1, although 80-90% of the other instances were POSITIVE. This type of reporting by the media is what create's these views in the first place. "If it dies it's live" "If it bleeds it leads" ""if it burns it earns" LOL

What have all the crybabys on here done anyhow but pout? How many volunteer hours have you put in for your local shelter? What have you done that constitutes you to be critical of everyone except yourself? Maybe you should check yourselfs and figure out where the bitterness is coming from??? After all if your not a part of the solution your part of them problem. Quit crying and do something with your life or go blow yourself up already. The US has done more for this planet in it's position than any other country would have. We are going to react no differently than anybody else would in OUR position. If any other country had our power, especially the ARAB states, the whole world would be in a much worse place than it is now.....believe it or not...... THE GREATEST COUNTRY TO, HAVE, AND WILL EVER EXIST.... ha ha.... bring the hate!!!!!
 
May 9, 2002
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#96
Now why should I bring the hate?

Cuz I stated my opinion from My Standpoint which NO Arguments and Replys from someone else can change and YOU consider your Opinion to be closer to the Truth than Mine????

there's always my side, your Side......and the Truth


(PS:
WAAAAAAY More than 10-20% of the World are crooked!! more like almost EVERYONE in one Way or another, Its just how much power and opportunities one has to Realize whats inside)
 
May 9, 2002
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#97
and I AM BY NO MEANS A SUPPORTER OF ANY GOVERNMENT
Be it Europe or the Arabs!

Its just the People that I grew up wit and got my cultural identity from (Or however u wanna call it) that i feel close to
 
May 19, 2002
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#98
LOL at all these simplistic fools saying "fuckin tree huggers!" is that all you got to say you dam fools. at least come articulate, and not just some vague labeling of someone with a different opinion then yours. patriotic/white/gangster rap loving kids kill me sometimes