Mosley or Pacquiao?
- Thread starter Timm
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Even when he was significantly stronger than his opponents and 130 he wasn't knocking people out.
Diaz got knocked into la la land by Kendall Holt, who does have one punch power. He kinda wanted to keep going but I thought he was winning that fight until Holt turned the fight around. I think it was 2 punches if I remember, but still.
Fact is, Manny hasn't had 1 punch power at any weight. He's shown quite a bit of power and knocked quite a few people down, but for the most part he's never really stopped guys early in fights, much less with one punch
Diaz got knocked into la la land by Kendall Holt, who does have one punch power. He kinda wanted to keep going but I thought he was winning that fight until Holt turned the fight around. I think it was 2 punches if I remember, but still.
Fact is, Manny hasn't had 1 punch power at any weight. He's shown quite a bit of power and knocked quite a few people down, but for the most part he's never really stopped guys early in fights, much less with one punch
I don't know man, knocking down JMM 3 times in the first round who had never been down in his career up to that point, KO'ing Morales in 3, KO'ing 3K Battery in 4, KO'ing Hatton in 2 and a lot of other guys he KO'd early prior to the first JMM fight. He's got 1 punch power in him.
In regards to Kendall Holt KO'ing Diaz, Holt is pretty damn big compared to Diaz and I believe that fight was at 140, but Holt didn't 1 punch KO diaz. The fight was stopped by the ref in the 8th or 9th round because Diaz took like 10-20 really hard shots (diaz was still fighting back), and Diaz never touched the canvas and was on his feet and wanted to keep fighting.
What pacquiao did to diaz no other fighter had done and sure he ate a ton of punches but the KO was still a devastating shot regardless.
In regards to Kendall Holt KO'ing Diaz, Holt is pretty damn big compared to Diaz and I believe that fight was at 140, but Holt didn't 1 punch KO diaz. The fight was stopped by the ref in the 8th or 9th round because Diaz took like 10-20 really hard shots (diaz was still fighting back), and Diaz never touched the canvas and was on his feet and wanted to keep fighting.
What pacquiao did to diaz no other fighter had done and sure he ate a ton of punches but the KO was still a devastating shot regardless.
That shot on diaz was obviously a good shot. But he'd beaten the piss out of him for 9 rounds. I was surprised Diaz was still on his feet at that point.
Battery is a joke. Can't even bring him up in this conversation really and even still it was 4 rounds.
I thought it was impressive that he knocked down Marquez and Barrera who has a great chin. Most of those knockdowns when he fought at 126 knocked the guy straight back and was almost a shot that knocked them off balance as much as anything else since he was on his toes and his whole body was moving forward. Those guys got up.
Morales has a great chin but he just got in a fire fight with manny for those last two fights and was generally beat down.
The KO of hatton and knockdowns of Cotto were sick though but either way I don't consider him a big one punch puncher but it definitely helps that he's so accurate. Look where he hit diaz in that gif lol Diaz was watching the floor on his way up anyways. He deserved to get knocked out
Battery is a joke. Can't even bring him up in this conversation really and even still it was 4 rounds.
I thought it was impressive that he knocked down Marquez and Barrera who has a great chin. Most of those knockdowns when he fought at 126 knocked the guy straight back and was almost a shot that knocked them off balance as much as anything else since he was on his toes and his whole body was moving forward. Those guys got up.
Morales has a great chin but he just got in a fire fight with manny for those last two fights and was generally beat down.
The KO of hatton and knockdowns of Cotto were sick though but either way I don't consider him a big one punch puncher but it definitely helps that he's so accurate. Look where he hit diaz in that gif lol Diaz was watching the floor on his way up anyways. He deserved to get knocked out
Why not? That was the only time he'd been KO'd in his career. But that's kind of my point. When you get to the higher level guys and elite fighters, 1 punch KO's are pretty rare. You just don't see them often these days. That's why the KO of hatton and Martinez over Williams are so shocking or even Donaire over Montiel.
When you get to the higher levels of boxing there is a reason. You must have a pretty good beard and/or good enough defense to roll with punches, etc.
If pac was fighting lower level guys (and his own weight) he would be a KO machine.
When you get to the higher levels of boxing there is a reason. You must have a pretty good beard and/or good enough defense to roll with punches, etc.
If pac was fighting lower level guys (and his own weight) he would be a KO machine.
look at battery's opposition. Way more loses than wins. He's not the worst fighter in the world but he's never really beaten quality opposition from what I remember.
And Pac might find better competition if he fought at 140lbs in the last year-year and a half. Especially better than he's been facing. It's no gimme that he would be knocking out those guys.
And Pac might find better competition if he fought at 140lbs in the last year-year and a half. Especially better than he's been facing. It's no gimme that he would be knocking out those guys.
I'm not saying he's elite either. My point was you get to the higher levels and it's very difficult to get consistent "1 punch KO's." Rarely ever in boxing history do you see guys that can fight elite opponents and do it consistantly. Against lower level guys or maybe even contenders, no doubt.
**Also just to point out about Fahsan 3K Battery, when you boxrec a Thai fighter and look at opponents records quite often boxrec does not have complete data regarding opponents, so you can't accurately say for certain what a Thai fighters record is. For example you could see a guy on there who is listed at 8-8 but in fact has over 50 fights in Thailand.
**Also just to point out about Fahsan 3K Battery, when you boxrec a Thai fighter and look at opponents records quite often boxrec does not have complete data regarding opponents, so you can't accurately say for certain what a Thai fighters record is. For example you could see a guy on there who is listed at 8-8 but in fact has over 50 fights in Thailand.
In fairness most of the unregistered fights are big time mismatches etc. If Fahsan has other fights I doubt it's much to speak of.
But I haven't seen Fahsan hurt very much only in the Pac fight where he was battered for 4 rounds and Fahsan was good enough to have Molitor hurt years after his loss to Pacman.
Fighters at a high level shouldn't be getting one punched anyway. It's the reason there at a high level. Which makes it amazingly impressive when a high level talent can one punch another high level talent.
But I haven't seen Fahsan hurt very much only in the Pac fight where he was battered for 4 rounds and Fahsan was good enough to have Molitor hurt years after his loss to Pacman.
Fighters at a high level shouldn't be getting one punched anyway. It's the reason there at a high level. Which makes it amazingly impressive when a high level talent can one punch another high level talent.
Pacquiao is 'killing himself in training' - Roach
Freddie Roach claims Manny Pacquiao is "on fire" ahead of his May 7 showdown with Shane Mosley in Las Vegas.
Pacquiao is on a 13-fight win streak and he is fully expected to beat Mosley in a little over a week's time. However, there are no signs that the Filipino is taking things easy, according to trainer Roach.
The WBO welterweight title is on the line at the MGM Grand, and Roach claims his charge may well be in the best shape that he has ever been before a fight.
"Manny is really motivated for Shane Mosley," said Roach. "We started in the mountains in the first day of training and he's been consistently trying to kill his body. He ran yesterday for an hour and 10 minutes. He's just in great shape and this may be his best training camp we've ever had.
"Usually it takes us a little while to get into the flow of training camp, but from day one he's been on fire. I mean we did eight rounds of mitts in the first day of training camp and he hadn't been in the gym since the last fight.
"We've just run out of room to go. He does 16 rounds a day on the mitts right now and I'm going to start holding him back a little bit. That's the hardest part of Manny Pacquiao - slowing him down."
Victory for Pacquiao would inevitably conjure up more talk about a showdown with Floyd Mayweather Jnr, but the Pacman has given up predicting the American's next move.
"It's hard to judge him. I really don't have an idea. We don't know so it's hard to judge him," said Pacquiao.
Freddie Roach claims Manny Pacquiao is "on fire" ahead of his May 7 showdown with Shane Mosley in Las Vegas.
Pacquiao is on a 13-fight win streak and he is fully expected to beat Mosley in a little over a week's time. However, there are no signs that the Filipino is taking things easy, according to trainer Roach.
The WBO welterweight title is on the line at the MGM Grand, and Roach claims his charge may well be in the best shape that he has ever been before a fight.
"Manny is really motivated for Shane Mosley," said Roach. "We started in the mountains in the first day of training and he's been consistently trying to kill his body. He ran yesterday for an hour and 10 minutes. He's just in great shape and this may be his best training camp we've ever had.
"Usually it takes us a little while to get into the flow of training camp, but from day one he's been on fire. I mean we did eight rounds of mitts in the first day of training camp and he hadn't been in the gym since the last fight.
"We've just run out of room to go. He does 16 rounds a day on the mitts right now and I'm going to start holding him back a little bit. That's the hardest part of Manny Pacquiao - slowing him down."
Victory for Pacquiao would inevitably conjure up more talk about a showdown with Floyd Mayweather Jnr, but the Pacman has given up predicting the American's next move.
"It's hard to judge him. I really don't have an idea. We don't know so it's hard to judge him," said Pacquiao.
holy crap, mosley looks terrible.
In terms of one punch power, I usually don't think about 1 punch knockouts either. I usually think of game changing power with one single punch. Like a fighter is down on all the scorecards but they could seriously hurt you with one punch. I don't think Pac is that fighter. He still has very good power but that's not the type of fighter he is. I know there is an argument against that but he's not a one punch power type of guy. Think about all the clean punches he's landed on dudes faces and not knocked them out in the last 5-6 years. A one punch-power type of guy would be knocking people out sooner and more often with those types of power punches landed is all I'm saying.
In terms of one punch power, I usually don't think about 1 punch knockouts either. I usually think of game changing power with one single punch. Like a fighter is down on all the scorecards but they could seriously hurt you with one punch. I don't think Pac is that fighter. He still has very good power but that's not the type of fighter he is. I know there is an argument against that but he's not a one punch power type of guy. Think about all the clean punches he's landed on dudes faces and not knocked them out in the last 5-6 years. A one punch-power type of guy would be knocking people out sooner and more often with those types of power punches landed is all I'm saying.
hmm, I disagree I certainly think pac has "game changing" power. Fight was close with Cotto till bam, game changer! Even Margarito was doing ok then BAM pac nailed him with a nasty shot in round 4 or 5 (can't recall exactly). His knockdown of JMM the 2nd time was what won him the fight.
Another thing is that game changing shot you speak of, we don't get to see him actually have to go for it very often, as with exception to JMM a few years ago, all of his fights he's been dominating. Who's to say he couldn't have stopped a 20 pound heavier margarito if he really wanted to? He admitted he went easy on him the last few rounds.
Another thing is that game changing shot you speak of, we don't get to see him actually have to go for it very often, as with exception to JMM a few years ago, all of his fights he's been dominating. Who's to say he couldn't have stopped a 20 pound heavier margarito if he really wanted to? He admitted he went easy on him the last few rounds.
That was my point though. He could've stopped Margarito late but it was the accumulation of punches more than anything. Margarito still kinda rallied in the 6th round or whatever it was and he was coming forward until the last 1/4th of that fight
I said the Cotto punch showed power already. No denying that but it was also right on the point of the chin and cotto didn't see it coming. They weren't huge punches it didn't seem like, they were perfectly placed. He's super accurate. No denying that either.
JMM is a bad example to me though because he's been rocked a bunch of times, even by feather-fisted Juan Diaz. He was dropped by Mayweather, Katsidis, and Barrera too. Most of those times he wasn't all that hurt if at all though.
I said the Cotto punch showed power already. No denying that but it was also right on the point of the chin and cotto didn't see it coming. They weren't huge punches it didn't seem like, they were perfectly placed. He's super accurate. No denying that either.
JMM is a bad example to me though because he's been rocked a bunch of times, even by feather-fisted Juan Diaz. He was dropped by Mayweather, Katsidis, and Barrera too. Most of those times he wasn't all that hurt if at all though.