Miguel Cotto vs. Zab Judah set for June 9th

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May 5, 2002
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miggidy said:
The last time I checked, cats in here are praising his heart.
You seem to liken punch output with courage.
What if he wasn't throwing for the reasons I mentioned above, what if it was all of the above? What does that have to do with balls????
The man took a beating and took it like a man.
Praising his heart? Im sorry NO ONE at Judah's level should be given a patt on the back 4 not quitting, in the fashion that he did.

Maybe I've seen better fights where someone showed 5x more heart than Judah. They had been knocked down or known they were in there with a bigger puncher, they didnt have their legs, they were bleeding like a faucet runs and still went out tryn to swing.

Judah knew this, and I shit you not..
if he wanted to let his lands loose he was gonna get his body tenderized, and that wasnt worth doing 4 him. He wasnt bitch enough to outright quit but he wasnt man enough to put in place a strategy he knew would win. He had givin up and relegated himself to the punchers chance (and he isnt baby Tyson). Im sure the ONLY reason Yoel Judah didnt throw in the towel b/c was b/c he wanted to let his son to go out on his own accord.

And to me, what Judah didnt do is the stuff that earns u the right to say u have heart. Ill say he was courageous but thats a long way from demonstrating Heart. Like I said b4 Paul M. showed way more heart than Judah did if u think just standing in the ring and withstanding crippling punches without mounting his own offensive is heart, not listening to your corner tell u to punch and all u do is punch 1 at a time is heart. Im sorry Judah had way more to give but didnt want it bad enough and thats not heart to me.

Effort is the key, and there's no way you can tell me Judah gave 100% effort. When i see someone give 100% effort even in a loss, be it by decision or 6th round KO, thats heart.
 

Tony

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May 15, 2002
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^You've got good points. I feel you though dog. You're saying if Jab had heart he would have fought back instead of taking the punishment that he did. Having heart is fighting back not taking a beating like he did. I feel you!!

Miggidy, there's no way Cotto could even hang with Mayweather. Cotto's style is perfect for Mayweather because Cotto would walk right into Mayweather's punches. And Cotto wouldn't apply pressure like De La Hoya did. De La Hoya is an A+ fighter and Mayweather outboxed him. Mayweather would beat Cotto up like he did Gatti.
 
May 5, 2002
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damn. glad someone feels the point im gettin across.

it was a very entertaining fight. Cotto is promissing, but im not gonna get too happy about it til he beats someone who hasnt cracked in EVERY 1 of his big fights. Kinda like Trinidad v William Joppy and then reality set in when he tried to face B Hop
 
Jul 24, 2002
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4fifteenRolla said:
Im not putting them in the same league. And secondly I was referring to how u said Cotto would match up to PBF. Styles make fights and Floyd chooses em carefully, and Cotto's style would fit perfectly. Im not sayin its gonna be easy but it wont be a loss 4 Floyd. Cotto can look like a great offensive fighter against people who will sit infront of him waitin on a counter they never throw, but not against a man that understands angles, fighting going backwards and faster hands with more power.
If you didn't say it wouldn't be easy for Floyd, why did you respond in the first place?

4fifteenRolla said:
I dunno about struggles. Its not just a cake walk 4 him, because they are great fighters themselves. Do u clown on ur fav football team when they beat the worst team in the league by 45 but consistantly beat their rivals by ONLY 3 or 7?
Do you?

4fifteenRolla said:
Unless ur Floyd Mayweather, Sugar Ray Leonard, Sugar Shane, or someone with blazing speed, that Judah doesnt possess most of the time u wont beat ur opponent to the punch when u counter but u will catch em right after they catch u when they r exposed. So yeah it goes without saying that Cotto was landing 1st because he was being ALLOWED to throw first. And of course Cotto wore down Judah because Judah wasnt punching enough to keep him off him.
So Judah doesn't have his blazing speed most of the time according to you now? In the early rounds when Judah's punch output was higher, Cotto ceased the oppertunity and started attacking Judah more. He beat him to the punch then and in the late rounds when Judah's punch output dropped.

4fifteenRolla said:
Praising his heart? Im sorry NO ONE at Judah's level should be given a patt on the back 4 not quitting, in the fashion that he did.

Maybe I've seen better fights where someone showed 5x more heart than Judah. They had been knocked down or known they were in there with a bigger puncher, they didnt have their legs, they were bleeding like a faucet runs and still went out tryn to swing.

Judah knew this, and I shit you not..
if he wanted to let his lands loose he was gonna get his body tenderized, and that wasnt worth doing 4 him. He wasnt bitch enough to outright quit but he wasnt man enough to put in place a strategy he knew would win. He had givin up and relegated himself to the punchers chance (and he isnt baby Tyson). Im sure the ONLY reason Yoel Judah didnt throw in the towel b/c was b/c he wanted to let his son to go out on his own accord.

And to me, what Judah didnt do is the stuff that earns u the right to say u have heart. Ill say he was courageous but thats a long way from demonstrating Heart. Like I said b4 Paul M. showed way more heart than Judah did if u think just standing in the ring and withstanding crippling punches without mounting his own offensive is heart, not listening to your corner tell u to punch and all u do is punch 1 at a time is heart. Im sorry Judah had way more to give but didnt want it bad enough and thats not heart to me.

Effort is the key, and there's no way you can tell me Judah gave 100% effort. When i see someone give 100% effort even in a loss, be it by decision or 6th round KO, thats heart.
So EVERYONE else is wrong and you're right huh?
You seem to be bothered on a personal level a little too much.
You give me the impression that you wanted to see Cotto beat so bad that you expected the world out of Judah.
Lace up the gloves and go after him yourself.
There are NO cowards in professional boxing.
People that are heartless do not reach the stage that Judah was in on Saturday night....
 
Jul 24, 2002
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Tony said:
Miggidy, there's no way Cotto could even hang with Mayweather. Cotto's style is perfect for Mayweather because Cotto would walk right into Mayweather's punches. And Cotto wouldn't apply pressure like De La Hoya did. De La Hoya is an A+ fighter and Mayweather outboxed him. Mayweather would beat Cotto up like he did Gatti.
I would agree with you to some extent if you would've said De La Hoya's success came from his height and reach advantage.

Cotto would come in behind a jab, unlike Gatti.
And unlike Gatti, Cotto wouldn't stand at the end of Mayweather's punches and sit there.
Cotto would bring on a lot of pressure and that would force Mayweather to adjust. Floyd didn't have to do any of that against Gatti.
 

Tony

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May 15, 2002
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He will once he gets knocked out by Mayweather. Zab exposed Cotto just like the other fighters that had him in trouble. If/when Mayweather gets him in trouble it's over. Cotto leaves himself open too much.
 
May 5, 2002
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miggidy said:
So EVERYONE else is wrong and you're right huh?
You seem to be bothered on a personal level a little too much.
You give me the impression that you wanted to see Cotto beat so bad that you expected the world out of Judah.
Lace up the gloves and go after him yourself.
There are NO cowards in professional boxing.
People that are heartless do not reach the stage that Judah was in on Saturday night....
Everyone? since when do the few 8 or so ppl on siccness.net sports forum represent everyone?

Bothered on a personal level? Not at all. But this is a Personal Opinion web site so i tend to discusss what i feel is right or wrong

Lastly i didnt expect the world from Judah, just more heart than he showed - especially all that talk about him being motivated (I guess what coaches say all the time is right, you play the way you practice). Also I've been watchin this foo since ESPN2 wasnt broadcasted in Frisco and he hasnt ONCE lived up to his true potential or ever laid it on the line. But he does have excuse upon excuse

Wait unless u include wins over ppl like, Allan Vester, Terronn Millett, and Wilfredo Negron as him having to show heart. Cuz all his loses were less than honorable. Wait but then again he did beat DeMarcus Corley & Omar Weiss. did u say who?

I didnt say Judah was a coward, i think i said he was courageous (about 5 or 6 times). But no where did he dig deep to show he has heart.

Answer me this, who displayed more heart when they fought Cotto, Judah or Malignaggi.. and why? When Malignaggi kept steppin in to throw could u clearly see his heart? When did Zab ever show that level of heart? Keep in mind that Zab is head n shoulders above Paul, unless u disagree