Valedictorian Speaks Out Against Schooling

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Jan 31, 2008
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#21
I think it's because she has this victim mentality, and blaming everyone but herself is pretty pathetic.
its only pathetic in your eyes because in relation to your own upbringing you have had the ability to see past the self victimizing role.

i dont know if you expected somebody who has been as indoctrinated as she to come out talking like jesus or something but in the end to play the "victim" is the limit of her scope of thinking. That is good enough for now.

ill draw on an example contextually related to this.

somebody is taught about "god" through the belief systems they come across, so they see the contradictions in the belief systems and discount everything that comes with it, including the concept of god. That seems to be the best they can do with the limited perspective that they are given, as their "extreme" is still within the confounds of their ideology.

her case is no different.

edit:"You replace one belief with another. You can't be without a belief. What you call 'you' is only a belief. If the belief goes, you go with it. That is the reason why, when you are not satisfied with one belief-structure, you replace it with another."
 
Aug 19, 2004
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#23
i dont know if you expected somebody who has been as indoctrinated as she to come out talking like jesus or something but in the end to play the "victim" is the limit of her scope of thinking. That is good enough for now.
Her message was to vague, and contradicts my own experiences in the public school system.

What kind of indoctrination did she go through to teach her to avoid outside interests, and not utilize any talent that she thinks she may have?

I'm at fault for assuming that she's pathetic. Maybe her schools curriculum really didn't offer art or music. Maybe her teachers really instilled in her that working for some corporation was the thing to aspire to, rather than chasing her dreams.

But I would assume that you'd be just as fault for assuming she went through indoctrination via the school system to lead her to having no interests, no talents, and questioning her own standing in the world.

If playing the victim is part of her progression as a person, that's great. That doesn't mean that I agree with what she says.
 
Jan 31, 2008
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#24
Her message was to vague, and contradicts my own experiences in the public school system.
her message was not vague.
her message is summed up in this clip:


i can break down the valedictorian speech statement by statement if you cannot make the correlation between the two videos.
What kind of indoctrination did she go through to teach her to avoid outside interests, and not utilize any talent that she thinks she may have?
she was taught acing the tests and being a 4.0 student is the talent.
isnt it what we are all told is what signifies how successful you are in school, and or how successful you will be in your career, implying life?
and arent we told that we need to be successful to lead meaningful 'productive lives'(what in their eyes is productive), and to validate our existence as real people?
youll never find ME working at MCDONALDS!

I'm at fault for assuming that she's pathetic. Maybe her schools curriculum really didn't offer art or music. Maybe her teachers really instilled in her that working for some corporation was the thing to aspire to, rather than chasing her dreams.
your assuming that she is pathetic was within the scope of your own perception of the world, which is directly related to the perception of your self.

But I would assume that you'd be just as fault for assuming she went through indoctrination via the school system to lead her to having no interests, no talents, and questioning her own standing in the world.
of course in the end i will speak on my comprehension of her words based on my own experience with the educational system .
nobody is at fault, including her.
the truth is, it just so happens that she was brainwashed by teachers and parents who were brainwashed themselves. Nobody is really taught to think for themselves. This will be a deep topic to get into but am willing to get into it although we will get off the discussion of the video itself.

If playing the victim is part of her progression as a person, that's great. That doesn't mean that I agree with what she says.
right, you cannot agree with what doesnt make sense to you. Just like i couldnt with agree with some of the replies in this thread instantly butchering her effort to really think outside the box for once, especially with the status of being "the one" who made it to the top in a sense, who is instead supposed to have absolutely nothing to complain about and remain quiet or praise the master that told her what the prize is and handed it to her.

EDIT: the truth is : "Society or culture or whatever you might want to call it, has created us all solely and wholly for the purpose of maintaining its continuity and status quo."
 
Nov 10, 2008
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#25
More like a slave bee?Public schools is basically about remembering..And why the fukc does kindergarten classes still teach useless songs like Itsy Bitsy spider or have the dreaded nap time?then comes the lies of history aka (his story) where america is adorned?When i went to school,i liked math and science!
 
Nov 10, 2008
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#26
I think it's because she has this victim mentality, and blaming everyone but herself is pretty pathetic.

Granted, there is always room for improvement, and public schooling is no exception, but her woe-is-me attitude is to typical these days.

I'm fairly certain that, like most highschools, music and art were offered in her school. She speaks about doodling in class. Why didn't she take a music or art class? Doesn't New York state highschool graduation requirements require an elective in either art, music or theater?

It seems to me like the public school system worked in this case, offering someone a good education and a chance at a stable life, regardless of lacking talent, passion or interests outside of acing tests.


This video wasnt a plea for sympathy,It was as real as anything else that is failing us such as the banking system and most policies set forth by your government.I wonder if more than half of you/s actuyally wnet to schol and tried it?
 
Aug 19, 2004
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#27
she was taught acing the tests and being a 4.0 student is the talent.
You weren't there anso how do you know? How do you know it wasn't a result of her parents pushing her to get straight A's and discouraging any outside interests?

You so sure in your assumption without being objective.

isnt it what we are all told is what signifies how successful you are in school, and or how successful you will be in your career, implying life?
In what ways, and by who? I was never told in school that just getting straight A's was my ticket to a happy life. Most of the teachers I had just wanted to make sure we learned something.

I think the idea of being financially successful equaling happiness has more to do with human emotion and how we compare ourselves to those around us. Also our scope of the world. Back in the day, you had people being content with what they had in relation to what their neighbors had, and their town was their life. Now you have television and instant internet access, so we're constantly comparing ourselves to movie stars, athletes, models, etc.

and arent we told that we need to be successful to lead meaningful 'productive lives'(what in their eyes is productive), and to validate our existence as real people?
Which is interesting because she speaks about being successful in contradiction to her being successful. She's just mad she wasn't successful in something else. Note she says, how the kids doodling in class instead of taking notes grow up to become great artists.

Either way she's implying success in a certain field is where fulfillment lies.

youll never find ME working at MCDONALDS!
Exactly. She doesn't want to be a corporate drone, and I'm assuming she doesn't want to flip burgers either . She could have been a GREAT, artist, musician, explorer, writer, etc.

She defines herself by her career.

the truth is, it just so happens that she was brainwashed by teachers and parents who were brainwashed themselves.
Do you know her or go the school that she went to to make such a definite statement?
 
Jan 31, 2008
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#28
You weren't there anso how do you know? How do you know it wasn't a result of her parents pushing her to get straight A's and discouraging any outside interests?

You so sure in your assumption without being objective.
lol who said anything about objectivity?
if you just listen to what the core of her message is, you shouldnt have such a hard time seeing the truth in it.
yes, as i stated in the last reply to you, her parents played a role in pushing her to get straight A's because they also were taught to think that sending their kids to school all day long, 5 days a week to be trained to THINK is really education and not indoctrination.

In what ways, and by who? I was never told in school that just getting straight A's was my ticket to a happy life. Most of the teachers I had just wanted to make sure we learned something.
getting the A's was only the proof of your succeeding in being educated. It is the education we were given that we were told would be our ticket to an easy life.
oh yeah, we were also taught what a life consists of also.
to be frank, i think your trouble in seeing what is being said here lies in your still swimming in your own indoctrinated values and ideas.
you can explain it as whatever, but until you really check and find out which thoughts that you think are actually yours, and which thoughts our founded on an idea of "who i am" and "what life is" then i dont think you will have the capacity to understand what is being conveyed here.

I think the idea of being financially successful equaling happiness has more to do with human emotion and how we compare ourselves to those around us. Also our scope of the world. Back in the day, you had people being content with what they had in relation to what their neighbors had, and their town was their life. Now you have television and instant internet access, so we're constantly comparing ourselves to movie stars, athletes, models, etc.
you can think what you want about why we equate financial success with happiness but the truth is "money" and the value of it is transient, "success" and what it means is transient, the value we give "success" is transient.
None of these things are founded on absolute values. So why do we take them to be founded in the one reality.
why are we not taught anything else?
i have nothing against the schools or teachers, but i do have a problem with idiots preaching bullshit and calling it "gold" to vulnerable minds.
yes, back in the day values were different, just as todays values arent static.
the problem here is that nobody is taught to think outside the box.

i dont know what kind of school u went to on what planet, but the fact is we are not taught to think for ourselves. We are not taught to question what we are being taught. We are taught to memorize data and spit them out on command so we can be utilized as a gear in this machine and lack the ability to question who runs the machine or how and why its being ran.

Which is interesting because she speaks about being successful in contradiction to her being successful. She's just mad she wasn't successful in something else. Note she says, how the kids doodling in class instead of taking notes grow up to become great artists.

Either way she's implying success in a certain field is where fulfillment lies.
no she isnt mad that she wasnt successful in something else, she is mad that she, as others, were only taught to view success in one way.
The A students are praised, while those who question the status quo or question the need to do homework are instead told to be quiet and held back year after year until they comply.
she talked about the kids doodling in class not because she wishes she was an artist, but instead she is saying "those kids who did not follow the rules and rather than pay attention in class were doing their own thing such as doodling, have found their calling in the future, while i, only know how to pass tests and follow orders. Ask me to survive on my own and since i have no capacity to think outside the box or follow my own desires, i will roll over and die.

Exactly. She doesn't want to be a corporate drone, and I'm assuming she doesn't want to flip burgers either . She could have been a GREAT, artist, musician, explorer, writer, etc.
i said that thing about not finding me in mcdonalds because that was the big scare that we were always reminded of growing up. Im not sure about you but many times "working at mcdonalds" was equated with "not being successful and happy".
again, i dont know what planet u were eductated on.

She defines herself by her career.
she, and we define ourselves by our careers because we are not taught to do otherwise.
we are not allowed to have our OWN thoughts if they go against the status quo.

Do you know her or go the school that she went to to make such a definite statement?
no i dont know her, but i have stepped outside the bounds of the indoctrination that i myself was in, only to find that i still replaced some ideas that were not mine, for more ideas that were not mine.

i can break that down if you want and i will.
ideas that we have about things, such as "society" or "education" are founded on more ideas that allow such ideas to be "valued ideas".
if you even follow those second layer of ideas you will find that they are standing on even more ideas, so on n so forth until you trace all of your ideas to ONE ROOT IDEA, and that is "the idea of me"
what you take yourself to be is what you take the world to be.
your relation with the world is really just an expression of an "idea" you have about yourself.

i wish you wouldnt selectively quote what i am saying.
i know i also did that with you in the beginning but as this gets longer and longer i feel like i have already answered some of your inquiries in past replies while you are taking my replies out of context and ask the same question all over again.

yes this is slowly turning into a discussion not about the ideas in the videos, but the ideas those ideas stand on, and this is the natural progression into explaining oneself.
 

HERESY

THE HIDDEN HAND...
Apr 25, 2002
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#30
OK..so what does this have to do with anything? Memory is part of cognition, which is the backbone of learning and knowledge. Without memory, you have no knowledge. Why do you think they drill you with the same shit over and over?
What I believe he is implying is that a person behaves like a parrot and doesn't have a true understanding or applied knowledge of what it is they're parroting.
 
Feb 7, 2006
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#32
Yeah most schools rely to much on rote memory, then the kids just release everything they memorize to make room for the next test/subject.
 
Feb 7, 2006
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#34
I dont know if it was Mr. Nice GUy or CB, I think it was CB actually who posted one of those RSA videos about how are school system is outdated...Might be good to post that again.
 
Dec 2, 2006
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#36
What I take from her message is that you don't let anybody define you, you define you. Even if those above you may think it is wrong, do what floats your boat within the unwritten moral codes of society.

I also think she is saying that although she attained a level of success so many aspire to reach acedemically, it wasn't who she was. Let people be them and quit judging.... Only you know what you like.

Great convo thus far from everyone.
 
May 24, 2007
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#37
getting the A's was only the proof of your succeeding in being educated. It is the education we were given that we were told would be our ticket to an easy life.
I think you've touched on a good point here. Getting A's is what the educational system rewards. I dont know about what kinds of expiriences everyone on here had with the schools they attended, but i remember most of the attention went to those who displayed an apt for good grades.
Almost all those who were straggling along did not recieve the same quality of attention that they probably needed; or touch on the types of subjects that were actually of interest to them, myself included.

On a side note, I did enjoy some subjects such a history. But then again, we were only taught one perspective of history in school.
 
Jan 31, 2008
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#38
What I believe he is implying is that a person behaves like a parrot and doesn't have a true understanding or applied knowledge of what it is they're parroting.
co-sign

ive come to find that intelligence is not decided by your knowledge or memorization , but your understanding.

you can be as book smart as possible but really your intelligence is only one of utilizing your ability to memorize and nothing more.
 
Jan 31, 2008
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#39
You could only blame so much on the schools. They are just part of the reason students are more interested in TRL than learning; or whatever the fuck they're watching these days...
i agree...
the same influence on the schools from the top seems to be similar to the influence on other matters such as the media.

i honestly still am not sure tho, if the control is 100% intentional or if really we are just living in a planet filled with monkeys (no insult to monkeys intended)

i tend to sway towards the opinion that much of it, tho not all, is intentional.
 
May 24, 2007
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#40
^^^ I think that is a key question, are we being intentionally sidetracked in a methodical fashion, or is this just how the pieces have fallen? I think the way we anwer this question determines substantially how we relate to the system and our attitude towards it.