RIP Pat Tillman

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DubbC415

Mickey Fallon
Sep 10, 2002
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Tomato Alley
#61
2-0-Sixxx...u need to draw the line somewhere....u dont know me, and while im not sure, i think its safe to say that u dont know any of these other people on this board. Dont assume i dont care about anyone, i think ur a little too quick to say we (or just I) dont care about Robert Smith or John Anderson or any of the Iraqi civilians. This thread was about Tillman, so i said RIP and was offended by the people who involve other shit that doesnt need to be involved in this thread. as said before, this is a thread where if u have nothing good to say, dont say it.
 
May 13, 2002
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#62
I wasn't aware their are rules involved in this thread. Can you please direct me to where it says "if u have nothing good to say, dont say it."?

Everyone on this board is welcome to voice their opinions which is exactly what I did. If you don't like what I have to say, well, too bad.


Either he was an evil man who wanted to kill Muslims or he was too fucking stupid to realize he was being lied to by his own government. Either way, not good enough to get respect from 2-0-Sixx.
Oh, btw...I think the iraq/afgan war is completely relevent with this topic. This thread is about Tillman right? He died where? For what reasons? If Saddam died tomorrow and there was a thread about his death, would you be offended if someone talked shit about him for his brutal life he lived? Would you say that shit doesn't need to be involved in the thread?
 

B-Buzz

lenbiasyayo
Oct 21, 2002
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bhibago
last.fm
#63
^^ lmao, dont make this into a "you wouldnt say that to my face" thing. We're not gonna fight, and Im a 6'4" 235lbs agnostic, so yes I would say it to your face... The reason I care about him dying is because I knew him, he was friends with family friends of my father's. I had his jersey when he went to ASU and I have his Cardinals jersey. Im not someone who is saying, this guy is a hero because he left football to fight in a war, Im saying RIP out of respect for him and his family.

And I dont think he joined the Rangers for the specific reason that he wanted to go to the middle east to go killl arabs, he joined because he wanted to protect his country, which is the same reason the 9/11 pilots did what they did...

I dont wanna turn this into a thing where we go back and forth talking shit, I just didnt like the fact that you're talking shit about someone I respected
 
Aug 20, 2003
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#65
LET THE MAN RIP ALREADY.SOME OF YOU FOOLS DONT RESPECT ANYTHING.20 SIX THE MAN LOST HIS LIFE AND YOUR TALKING MAD SHIT.WOW I DIDNT SEE YOUR COMMENTS COMING.AND BEFORE YOU SAY WHAT ABOUT ALL THE INNOCENT PEOPLE THAT DIED OVER THERE,THATS A PART OF WAR.INNOCENT PEOPLE SHOULDNT DIE BUT IT HAPPENES.DO YOU THINK THAT IF YOU WERE OVER THERE THEY WOULDNT FUCK WITH YOU.THOES EXTRIMESTS WOULDNT HESITATE 2 BLAST YOU.THEY HATE ALL AMERICANS WEATHER YOU SUPPORT THE WAR OR NOT.AND YEAH BUSH FUCKED UP THIS WAR SHOULD OF NEVER HAPPENED.ALL OUR SOLIDERS NEED 2 COME HOME....
 
May 13, 2002
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#66
The genius speaks. You seem so intelligent when you respond in all caps. YO MAN, YOU THINK YOU COOL CUZ YOU TALK MAD SHIT BUT YO ASS WOULD BE DEAD SHOT BY XTREMISTS. ME PAY RESPEKT RIP PAT TILLMAN, HERO. YOU FUCK DONT KNOWING NOTHING. I DONT LEARN HOW TO WRITE PROPPER SENTENCES OR TALK TO PEOPLE SO YOU KNOW WHAT IM SAYIN
 
May 13, 2002
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#68
Sports as Propaganda
Randy Shaw, April 27, 2004

As much as we like to think of big-time sports as an escape from the "real" world, there are times when its politically conservative messages must not be ignored. That's why even non-sports fans should be troubled by the militaristic jingoism that accompanied media coverage of former NFL star Pat Tillman's death Thursday night while serving as an Army Ranger in Afghanistan.


Pat Tillman left the Arizona Cardinals football team in May 2002 to join the military as an Army Ranger. It was certainly newsworthy that someone earning big money as a pro athlete would give it up to join the military. But left unspoken in the sports media's ample coverage of Tillman is the recognition that most Americans dying overseas joined the military for economic reasons. Even the media that supported the war as a fight for freedom find it amazing that anyone would actually sacrifice money to join the warfare.


In the sports world, there was not a hint of ambiguity as to the merits of the cause in which Tillman lost his life. NFL Commissioner Paul Tagliabue stated that "like others protecting our freedom around the world, Pat made the ultimate sacrifice." After Tagliabue made his statement at the start of Saturday's NFL draft, the crowd repeatedly chanted "USA, USA." ESPN's NFL Analyst Mark Schlereth stated that "Tillman made the ultimate sacrifice so that the people of the country could be protected."


ESPN's Friday night Sports Center was all over the Tillman story, accompanying pictures of Tilllman with waving American flags. ESPN's website was similarly focused on Tillman, and its NFL Analyst Mark Schlereth stated that "Tillman made the ultimate sacrifice so that the people of the country could be protected." The Arizona Cardinals announced they would retire his number and that a plaza surrounding their new stadium would be named "Pat Tillman Freedom Plaza."


At the same time that the sports world was mounting its tribute to Tillman, Bush campaign operatives and their media allies were questioning Senator John Kerry's military service during Vietnam. Suddenly, Kerry's willingness to make "the ultimate sacrifice" and die for his country was no longer a sign of the great moral leadership the media associated with Tillman. In Kerry's case, the GOP got the media to raise questions about the nature of Kerry's war wounds, and whether all three of his Purple Hearts were deserved.


Of course, George W. Bush never made the "ultimate sacrifice" of risking his life for his country. But Bush once owned the Texas Rangers baseball team and claims to like NASCAR, and is regularly praised by sportscasters and writers for being a "real" sports fan and hence a "regular" guy.


Harry Edwards and other social critics of sport have argued that it was no accident that pro football's popularity rose along with the fighting in Vietnam. The reason football has not been taken up by other countries is that its militarism ("He's throwing a bomb" to describe a long pass) and inherent violence does not strike a chord in other lands.


The NFL regularly acts as propagandist for the US military. Any professional athlete questioning whether American troops overseas are really protecting America's freedom, or are instead a vehicle for US imperialism, would have their endorsements yanked and career shortened.


The NFL and America's military industrial establishment both reap billions from the actions of young African-American men, many of whom end up broke, maimed or both. Just as the American public has been shielded from seeing the caskets of those killed in Iraq, sports fans rarely see profiles of the beaten down ex-NFL players whose post-career lives mean pain, hardship and a much shortened life-expectancy.


Nearly all NFL owners are Republicans, and some, like Alex Spanos of the San Diego Chargers, are large donors to the GOP and conservative causes. NFL owners thus get the benefit of taxpayer-supported stadiums, a guaranteed profit, and the ability to use the seemingly apolitical arena of pro football to spread their political gospel to tens of millions of voters.


Now that progressives have finally gotten it together to create a talk-radio network, the next challenge is to further infiltrate the world of professional sports.


Randy Shaw is the author of The Activist's Handbook and editor on the on-line daily newspaper, BeyondChron. He can be reached at [email protected]
 
Apr 21, 2004
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#69
2-0-Sixx said:
Sports as Propaganda
Randy Shaw, April 27, 2004

As much as we like to think of big-time sports as an escape from the "real" world, there are times when its politically conservative messages must not be ignored. That's why even non-sports fans should be troubled by the militaristic jingoism that accompanied media coverage of former NFL star Pat Tillman's death Thursday night while serving as an Army Ranger in Afghanistan.


Pat Tillman left the Arizona Cardinals football team in May 2002 to join the military as an Army Ranger. It was certainly newsworthy that someone earning big money as a pro athlete would give it up to join the military. But left unspoken in the sports media's ample coverage of Tillman is the recognition that most Americans dying overseas joined the military for economic reasons. Even the media that supported the war as a fight for freedom find it amazing that anyone would actually sacrifice money to join the warfare.


In the sports world, there was not a hint of ambiguity as to the merits of the cause in which Tillman lost his life. NFL Commissioner Paul Tagliabue stated that "like others protecting our freedom around the world, Pat made the ultimate sacrifice." After Tagliabue made his statement at the start of Saturday's NFL draft, the crowd repeatedly chanted "USA, USA." ESPN's NFL Analyst Mark Schlereth stated that "Tillman made the ultimate sacrifice so that the people of the country could be protected."


ESPN's Friday night Sports Center was all over the Tillman story, accompanying pictures of Tilllman with waving American flags. ESPN's website was similarly focused on Tillman, and its NFL Analyst Mark Schlereth stated that "Tillman made the ultimate sacrifice so that the people of the country could be protected." The Arizona Cardinals announced they would retire his number and that a plaza surrounding their new stadium would be named "Pat Tillman Freedom Plaza."


At the same time that the sports world was mounting its tribute to Tillman, Bush campaign operatives and their media allies were questioning Senator John Kerry's military service during Vietnam. Suddenly, Kerry's willingness to make "the ultimate sacrifice" and die for his country was no longer a sign of the great moral leadership the media associated with Tillman. In Kerry's case, the GOP got the media to raise questions about the nature of Kerry's war wounds, and whether all three of his Purple Hearts were deserved.


Of course, George W. Bush never made the "ultimate sacrifice" of risking his life for his country. But Bush once owned the Texas Rangers baseball team and claims to like NASCAR, and is regularly praised by sportscasters and writers for being a "real" sports fan and hence a "regular" guy.


Harry Edwards and other social critics of sport have argued that it was no accident that pro football's popularity rose along with the fighting in Vietnam. The reason football has not been taken up by other countries is that its militarism ("He's throwing a bomb" to describe a long pass) and inherent violence does not strike a chord in other lands.


The NFL regularly acts as propagandist for the US military. Any professional athlete questioning whether American troops overseas are really protecting America's freedom, or are instead a vehicle for US imperialism, would have their endorsements yanked and career shortened.


The NFL and America's military industrial establishment both reap billions from the actions of young African-American men, many of whom end up broke, maimed or both. Just as the American public has been shielded from seeing the caskets of those killed in Iraq, sports fans rarely see profiles of the beaten down ex-NFL players whose post-career lives mean pain, hardship and a much shortened life-expectancy.


Nearly all NFL owners are Republicans, and some, like Alex Spanos of the San Diego Chargers, are large donors to the GOP and conservative causes. NFL owners thus get the benefit of taxpayer-supported stadiums, a guaranteed profit, and the ability to use the seemingly apolitical arena of pro football to spread their political gospel to tens of millions of voters.


Now that progressives have finally gotten it together to create a talk-radio network, the next challenge is to further infiltrate the world of professional sports.


Randy Shaw is the author of The Activist's Handbook and editor on the on-line daily newspaper, BeyondChron. He can be reached at [email protected]


Wanna know whos the real asshole in all this? Swimeon Rice. Former teammate of tillman on a espn interview said tillman wasnt any good and it didnt really matter that he joined the army. What a douche bag
 
Aug 20, 2003
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#70
2-0 six

HAHA YOU GOT ME.YOU CAN MISS ME WITH ALL THAT STUPID SHIT.20 six YOU ARE REACHIN.AND YOU TALK LOUD BUT AINT SAYIN SHIT.DAM MAN IF YOU DONT LIKE THE U.S. MOVE IM SURE IRAQ WOULD WELCOME YOU WITH OPEN ARMS.

AND I TYPE IN ALL caps BECAUSE IM LAZY.THERE'S ALOT OF CHAOS IN YOUR BRAIN.MABY ONE DAY YOU'LL COME TO YOUR SENSE'S.
 
May 13, 2002
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#71
^^^^Please stop typing. I think I lost massive amounts of brain cells after reading your reply.

2-0-Sixx said:
The genius speaks. You seem so intelligent when you respond in all caps. YO MAN, YOU THINK YOU COOL CUZ YOU TALK MAD SHIT BUT YO ASS WOULD BE DEAD SHOT BY XTREMISTS. ME PAY RESPEKT RIP PAT TILLMAN, HERO. YOU FUCK DONT KNOWING NOTHING. I DONT LEARN HOW TO WRITE PROPPER SENTENCES OR TALK TO PEOPLE SO YOU KNOW WHAT IM SAYIN

@VossOwnsAll,

Rice is my new favorite d-lineman :cool:
 
Aug 20, 2003
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#72
^^^^^^^^

I CAN SEE THAT I INTIMDATED YOU.SORRY ABOUT THAT.LOL.WE DONT SEE EYE TO EYE MAN.IT'S NOTHING PERSONAL.YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT SOMEONE THAT DIED ARE FUCKED UP.CANT YOU SEE THAT MAN.
 
May 13, 2002
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#74
SMOKIELOCS said:
I CAN SEE THAT I INTIMDATED YOU.SORRY ABOUT THAT.LOL.WE DONT SEE EYE TO EYE MAN.IT'S NOTHING PERSONAL.YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT SOMEONE THAT DIED ARE FUCKED UP.CANT YOU SEE THAT MAN.
Exactly. We don't see eye to eye. Just leave it at that. You may think it's fucked up, but others do not.

@Voss,
Go smoke some meth
 
Mar 12, 2004
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#76
2-0-Sixx said:
Sports as Propaganda
Randy Shaw, April 27, 2004

Pat Tillman left the Arizona Cardinals football team in May 2002 to join the military as an Army Ranger. It was certainly newsworthy that someone earning big money as a pro athlete would give it up to join the military. But left unspoken in the sports media's ample coverage of Tillman is the recognition that most Americans dying overseas joined the military for economic reasons. Even the media that supported the war as a fight for freedom find it amazing that anyone would actually sacrifice money to join the warfare.


Randy Shaw is the author of The Activist's Handbook and editor on the on-line daily newspaper, BeyondChron. He can be reached at [email protected]
http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/pnoonan/?id=110004997
Privileged to Serve
In this war, not only the sons and daughters of the poor are enlisting.

Friday, April 23, 2004 1:45 p.m. EDT

(Editor's note: This column appeared on July 12, 2002. Pat Tillman died in combat in Afghanistan yesterday.)

Maybe he was thinking Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country. Maybe it was visceral, not so much thought as felt, and acted upon. We don't know because he won't say, at least not in public. Which is itself unusual. Silence is the refuge of celebrities caught in scandal, not the usual response of those caught red-handed doing good.

All we know is that 25-year-old Pat Tillman, a rising pro football player (224 tackles in 2000 as a defensive back for the Arizona Cardinals, a team record) came back from his honeymoon seven weeks ago and told his coaches he would turn down a three-year, $3.6 million contract and instead join the U.S. Army. For a pay cut of roughly $3.54 million dollars over three years.

On Monday morning, Pat Tillman "came in like everyone else, on a bus from a processing station," according to a public information officer at Fort Benning, Ga., and received the outward signs of the leveling anonymity of the armed forces: a bad haircut, a good uniform and physical testing to see if he is up to the rigors of being a soldier. Soon he begins basic training. And whatever else happened this week--Wall Street news, speeches on the economy--nothing seems bigger, more important and more suggestive of change than what Pat Tillman did.

Those who know him say it's typical Tillman, a surprise decision based on his vision of what would be a good thing to do. When he was in college he sometimes climbed to the top of a stadium light tower to think and meditate. After his great 2000 season he was offered a $9 million, five-year contract with the St. Louis Rams and said thanks but no, he was happy with the Cardinals.

But it was clear to those who knew Mr. Tillman that after September 11 something changed. The attack on America had prompted a rethinking. Len Pasquarelli of ESPN reported last May that the "free-spirited but consummately disciplined" starting strong safety told friends and relatives that, in Mr. Pasquarelli's words, "his conscience would not allow him to tackle opposition fullbacks where there is still a bigger enemy that needs to be stopped in its tracks." Mr. Tillman's agent and friend Frank Bauer: "This is something he feels he has to do. For him, it's a mindset, a duty."





"I'm sorry, but he is not taking inquiries," said the spokeswoman at Fort Benning. She laughed when I pressed to speak to someone who might have seen Mr. Tillman or talked to him. Men entering basic training don't break for interviews, she said. Besides, "he has asked not to have any coverage. We've been respecting his wishes. And kinda hoping he'd change his mind." Mr. Tillman would, of course, be a mighty recruiting device. The Army might have enjoyed inviting television cameras to record his haircut, as they did with Elvis. But Mr. Tillman, the Fort Benning spokesman says, "wants to be anonymous like everyone else."
Right now he has 13 weeks of basic training ahead of him, then three weeks of Airborne School, and then, if he makes it, Ranger School, where only about a third of the candidates are accepted. "It's a long row," said the Fort Benning spokesman, who seemed to suggest it would be all right to call again around Christmas. Until then he'll be working hard trying to become what he wants to become.

Which I guess says it all.

Except for this. We are making a lot of Tillmans in America, and one wonders if this has been sufficiently noted. The other day friends, a conservative intellectual and his activist wife, sent a picture of their son Gabe, a proud and newly minted Marine. And there is Abe, son of a former high aide to Al Gore, who is a lieutenant junior grade in the Navy, flying SH-60 Seahawk helicopters. A network journalist and his wife, also friends, speak with anguished pride of their son, in harm's way as a full corporal in the Marines. The son of a noted historian has joined up; the son of a conservative columnist has just finished his hitch in the Marines; and the son of a bureau chief of a famous magazine was commissioned a second lieutenant in the Army last month, on the day he graduated from Princeton.

As the Vietnam-era song said, "Something's happening here." And what it is may be exactly clear. Some very talented young men, and women, are joining the armed forces in order to help their country because, apparently, they love it. After what our society and culture have been through and become the past 30 years or so, you wouldn't be sure that we would still be making their kind, but we are. As for their spirit, Abe's mother reports, "Last New Year's, Abe and his roommate [another young officer] were home and the topic came up about how little they are paid [compared with] the kids who graduated from college at the same time they did and went into business.

"Without missing a beat the two of them said, 'Yeah--but we get to get shot at!' and raised their beer bottles. No resentment. No anger. Just pure . . . testosterone-laden bravado."





The Abes and Gabes join a long old line of elders dressed in green, blue, gray, white, gold and black. Pat Tillman joins a similar line, of stars who decided they had work to do, and must leave their careers to do it. They include, among others, the actors Jimmy Stewart, Clark Gable and Tyrone Power in World War II; sports stars Ted Williams and Joe DiMaggio in the same war; and quarterback Roger Staubach in Vietnam. It is good to see their style return, and be considered noble again.
And good to see what appears to be part of, or the beginning of, a change in armed forces volunteering. In the Vietnam era of my youth it was poor and working-class boys whom I saw drafted or eagerly volunteering. Now more and more I see the sons and daughters of the privileged joining up.

That is a bigger and better story than usually makes the front page. Markets rise and fall, politicians come and go, but that we still make Tillmans is headline news.

Ms. Noonan is a contributing editor of The Wall Street Journal and author of "A Heart, a Cross, and a Flag" (Wall Street Journal Books/Simon & Schuster), a collection of post-Sept. 11 columns, which you can buy from the OpinionJournal bookstore. Her column appears Thursdays.
 
Jul 21, 2003
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#78
GODDAMN...ITS ALWAYS THE MOTHER FUCKERS THAT AINT BEEN TO IRAQ OR AFGHANISTAN THAT SWEAR JUST CUS THEY WATCH CNN OR READ REPORTS ON THE INTERNET THAT THEY AUTOMATICALLY KNOW WHAT ITS LIKE IN EITHER COUNTRY...ILL TELL YOU WHAT...IVE BEEN TO IRAQ AND IM IN AFGHANISTAN RIGHT NOW...THAT LIL PICTURE THAT YOU BROUGHT UP OF THE LITTLE AFGHANI KID...WHAT WAS THE POINT OF YOU DISPLAYING SUCH A TRAGEDY...ANOTHER THING ABOUT THAT LITTLE KID...MOST OF THE ACCIDENTS IN AFGHANISTAN ARE NOT CAUSED BY SOLDIERS OR TERRORISTS...BUT BY LANDMINES...AFGHANISTAN HAPPENS TO BE THE MOST HEAVILY LAND MINED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD JUST FOR THE FACT THAT THE USSR COVERED THIS BITCH BACK IN THE DAY...THERES BILLIONS OF PEOPLE THAT LOOK LIKE THAT...ANY FUCKIN WAY...IGNORANCE IS A MOTHER FUCKER...THE MAN LOST HIS LIFE...WHETHER HE BE FAMOUS OR FUCKIN JOHN DOE...IT DONT MATTER...THE MAN STEPPED UP FOR WHAT HE BELIEVED IN AND SACRAFICED A PAYCHECK LIKE MOST AMERICAN PATRIOTS WOULD NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT...IF HE WERE STILL ALIVE AND GITTIN READY TO COME HOME ID STILL SAY HES A HERO...MOST SOLDIERS ENLIST FOR COLLEGE OR MONEY...THIS WAS AN UNSELFISH ACT AND THE MAN DESERVES RESPECT WHETHER YOU BELIEVE IN WHAT HE REPRESENTS OR NOT...YOURE ALSO RIGHT ABOUT THAT "WHAT ABOUT THEM PILOTS"...WELL GUESS WHAT HOMEBOY...I DONT KNOW OF ANY IRAQIS ON THIS MESSAGE BOARD...WHAT I DO KNOW IS THIS IS AN AMERICAN FORUM...YOU TYPE SHIT LIKE THE BULLSHIT THAT YOU BEEN TYPING AND YOURE BOUND TO GET CUSSED OUT BY NUMEROUS PEOPLE...TELL ME THAT MY BEING IN THE MILITARY IS "STUPID"...FUCK YOU MAN...I RISK MY ASS DAILY SO THAT MOTHER FUCKERS LIKE YOU DONT HAVE TO GET DRAFTED...LAST BUT NOT LEAST...WAR STARTED OUT GREAT...IT GOT FUCKED UP...CREDABILITY LOST...BUT WE STARTED SOMETHING AND REGUARDLESS OF THE OUTCOME...WE GOTTA FINISH IT...$IDEWAYZ

R.I.P. PAT TILLMAN
 
May 13, 2002
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#79
If you're in the military fighting in Afgan or Iraq, you are supporting Bu$hCo. plain and simple. What do you want me to do, Typcee? Say thanks?

You know that's not the kind of person I am. Why should I give respect to someone who is doing exactly what I am against? It doesn't make any sense.

So, I say 'Fuck Pat Tillman'.

I got nothing against you, Typcee. I personally think what you are doing is wrong. If you die tomorrow and people start posting threads about "The Siccnesses own Hero" I will say basically the same shit. Except I'm sure you joined for different reasons then Tillman and you didn't have a multi-million dollar contract in your face.