Manny Pacquiao ready to fight Shane Mosley, possibly on Oct. 17th
- Thread starter 2-0-Sixx
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Look just remember when you are responding to my comments that this is not an issue of wether Floyd is an All Time Great. I am saying that he is the best at 140,147,150 right now. All the current fighters have faught journeymen or past their prime fighters. Pac Man doesn't have a great defense, nor does Margo, Shane (because of his aggresive mind set), Cotto is respectable, Hatton (ha,ha), Floyd has the extra ability. Understand this of all the names Floyd is the most comfortable, and natural of these fighters. He just seems to understand the ring better. Only Whittaker had that...until he got to old and ran into Tito. Floyd will eventualy loose if he stays in the game...then you lames can start howling "I told you he wasn't great". But the fighters you back up have 3-5 losses on their record.
^^lol, I just broke down that having losses means very little. Ali = 5 losses. Yeah, he sucked what a bum! Ray Robinson, 19 losses he's got nothin on FLOYD!!! lmao, get out of here with that nonsense.
And you're right, floyd may very well be the best at 140-147. The problem is, HE DOESNT FIGHT THE BEST!! That's my issue with Floyd. I love him as a fighter, he's brilliant inside the ring, but he choice of opponents has been a joke since stepping up in weight. When was the last time Floyd fought a legit 147 pound fighter? I'll tell you - Zab Judah in 2006. And Baldomir (haha) is the only other real 147 pounder he faced. Baldy, as in Carlos. They guy who fights in slow motion.
Where is cotto on his resume? margarito? shane mosley? paul williams? They all fight each other, but floyd is no where to be found. And he has a Marquez next, a legit 135 pound fighter!
And you're right, floyd may very well be the best at 140-147. The problem is, HE DOESNT FIGHT THE BEST!! That's my issue with Floyd. I love him as a fighter, he's brilliant inside the ring, but he choice of opponents has been a joke since stepping up in weight. When was the last time Floyd fought a legit 147 pound fighter? I'll tell you - Zab Judah in 2006. And Baldomir (haha) is the only other real 147 pounder he faced. Baldy, as in Carlos. They guy who fights in slow motion.
Where is cotto on his resume? margarito? shane mosley? paul williams? They all fight each other, but floyd is no where to be found. And he has a Marquez next, a legit 135 pound fighter!
Another thing about this, if you compare mayweather to pacquiao.
2 of Pacquiao's losses came when he was a teenager.
When Mayweather was the same age as Pac and even older, do you know how many times he lost? Mayweather lost 6 times in the same time period.
the difference is pacquiao didn't have the luxury of having a long amateur career to work on his game, he had to turn pro at 15 years old and learn on the job, because he was poor and needed the money.
That's the difference between mayweather and pac and pac being 51-1 versus 49-3.
And by the way, Barrera was 29 years old when he first fought Pac, Eric Morales was 29 and then 30 when they fought as well. So this talk about Pacquiao beating up old guys is simply not true. Oscar would be the one exception.
2 of Pacquiao's losses came when he was a teenager.
When Mayweather was the same age as Pac and even older, do you know how many times he lost? Mayweather lost 6 times in the same time period.
the difference is pacquiao didn't have the luxury of having a long amateur career to work on his game, he had to turn pro at 15 years old and learn on the job, because he was poor and needed the money.
That's the difference between mayweather and pac and pac being 51-1 versus 49-3.
And by the way, Barrera was 29 years old when he first fought Pac, Eric Morales was 29 and then 30 when they fought as well. So this talk about Pacquiao beating up old guys is simply not true. Oscar would be the one exception.
Morales was on the decline by the time Pacquiao fought him though and Pacquiao got outboxed in the first fight and that simply hasnt happened to Mayweather yet but i feel you on the greatest fighters having the a lot of losses though. You can add De La Hoya to that list cuz he fought everyone pretty much and has 6 loses.
I think Mosley is gonna be to strong for Pacquiao, this is a dangerous fight for Pacquiao. I think Mosley will win by TKO in no later then 8 rounds.
I think Mosley is gonna be to strong for Pacquiao, this is a dangerous fight for Pacquiao. I think Mosley will win by TKO in no later then 8 rounds.
Barrera had brain damage, Morrales was not the same fighter. They both drained each other by the time Manny got to them. Look this the point every time Floyd up in weight he faught Gotti. They said Gotti was to big to much of a brawler and Floyd couldn't run forever. After the fight Gotti was a bumb all along and that's the same conclusion that happens with Pac Man when he beat Oscar. I'm not basing my opion on who beat who...the record is what it is, Floyd has zero loses. He won his title by taking a considerable risk to his young career by taking on Hernandez. Flyod is not ducking any of these bumbs he just making it more of a money market. Think about it Floyd loves the money more than his perfect record. If the risk is worth it he'll be all in. Right now the money is with Pac Man just like it was with Oscar.
WHAT?!? Are you smoking, seriously? Everyone and their mama knew floyd was going to whoop his ass and it was a serious mismatch, even floyd said Gotti was a C level fighter. Floyd was a 5-1 to 8-1 favorite depending on various betting locations.
And by your own logic Gatti was old and way past it as he was 33 years old and "drained" himself from previous wars with Ward (x3), Oscar de la hoya, Ivan Robinson, etc.
So Pacquiao beats up a 29 year old champion Barrera, who according to you had brain damage, and was drained from Morales, and yet Floyd gets some huge pass and gets credit for beating a 33 year old "C level fighter" who drained himself after being in countless wars and couldn't even speak complete sentances??!?!? get out of here with that!
That's fine and dandy if Floyd is only after the money, he has that right and that's his option. But he can't call himself the greatest fighter of all time like he often does without proving it. Being great isn't just about ones skill set and natural athleticism, it's also based on one's resume, accomplishments and most importantly, how they did against the BEST fighters in their times. If the criteria was based on natural athleticism alone, Roy Jones would be considered the greatest fighter in the history of the sport. But Roy didn't really have that great of a resume and fought a ton of bums.
Again, I use Joe Calzaghe as a prime example. He retired 46-0. That's BETTER than Mayweather. But who did he beat? Prospect Jeff Lacy, untested Kessler, 79 year old Bernard hopkins and 40 year old Roy Jones. Good career? Absolutely. All time Great? No way.
And by your own logic Gatti was old and way past it as he was 33 years old and "drained" himself from previous wars with Ward (x3), Oscar de la hoya, Ivan Robinson, etc.
So Pacquiao beats up a 29 year old champion Barrera, who according to you had brain damage, and was drained from Morales, and yet Floyd gets some huge pass and gets credit for beating a 33 year old "C level fighter" who drained himself after being in countless wars and couldn't even speak complete sentances??!?!? get out of here with that!
That's fine and dandy if Floyd is only after the money, he has that right and that's his option. But he can't call himself the greatest fighter of all time like he often does without proving it. Being great isn't just about ones skill set and natural athleticism, it's also based on one's resume, accomplishments and most importantly, how they did against the BEST fighters in their times. If the criteria was based on natural athleticism alone, Roy Jones would be considered the greatest fighter in the history of the sport. But Roy didn't really have that great of a resume and fought a ton of bums.
Again, I use Joe Calzaghe as a prime example. He retired 46-0. That's BETTER than Mayweather. But who did he beat? Prospect Jeff Lacy, untested Kessler, 79 year old Bernard hopkins and 40 year old Roy Jones. Good career? Absolutely. All time Great? No way.
I don't get why people are even arguing this. Records mean a god damn thing, close out your boxrec window and watch some fights. Judging people by wins and losses without taking into account who they won and lost to is retarded .. especially in this case when most the fighters in question have losses to people Floyd never stepped in the ring with.
Okay so both Pacquiao and Arum are denying the validity of this fight.
http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=20241
http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=20241
Everytime you respond to my comments you add another equation to the debate. I don't despute some of the things you bring about but I don't agree with all. Flyod is a better fighter than the current crop of "stars". I used the Gotti accomplishment not to seperate his victory from that of Pac Mans but rather to lump it in the same catagory. Floyd beat Oascar and Hatton before Pac got to em. In both fights with Pac neither fighter looked the same...they looked tarnished. We could argue Floyd stole their thunder and Pac beat up on some retreads. I'm not debating that, but Floyd is undefeated and he has faced good opposition in his career and has been tested once physically and a number of times emotionaly, which is obbvious by his reactions after winning certain fights. The man is not affraid to fight any of these dudes they just had to build their stock up for this to be worth it. Manny just entered the debate after the HATTON/DELAHOYA match, Shane after MARGARITO/? (forgot the guys name)/DIAZE. Why waist your time taking on challenge after challenge and loosing out on the build up of the "HYPE"= MONEY? Oh yah and quit bringing up Joe Calzaghe and his record as an example because you damn well he aint Floyd or Roy. My agruement remains this Floyd is a better fighter than these cats just by watching his technique of rolling with punches, positioning, faints, in fighting, outside fighting overall versatility.
ok, and my point is he should fight these guys he supposedly can beat so easy. Why fight Marquez and not Cotto or Mosley or ____? Who the hell is marquez to anybody outside of the boxing community? If Mr. Mayweather is all about the $$$$, Marquez has been on like one PPV and that was against Pacquiao. Where is the logic in that?
Floyd could make MORE MONEY against the following:
Pacquiao (biggest fight possible).
Shane Mosley (very recognizable name outside of the hardcore fans).
Miguel Cotto (huge Puerto Rican following).
I'll give floyd the benefit of the doubt and take his word that marquez is his tune up fight, so we'll see what he chooses after he beats him.
Floyd could make MORE MONEY against the following:
Pacquiao (biggest fight possible).
Shane Mosley (very recognizable name outside of the hardcore fans).
Miguel Cotto (huge Puerto Rican following).
I'll give floyd the benefit of the doubt and take his word that marquez is his tune up fight, so we'll see what he chooses after he beats him.