Free Speech and the Family are Incompatible
- Thread starter Dirty Shoez
- Start date
Whats funny is you automatically add every pinko leftie label you can think of to a fairly non-political issue.
The issue is not family, Poopy Shoes, its the fact that you are posting information that compromises, endangers, or subjects another person to financial or personal vulnerability. This falls under the same category as screaming "Fire" in a crowded building.
Your point A to point C argument is that since many "Liberals" dont believe in most censorship, the logical conclusion is that all censorship must be removed. This is like saying "Hey, you're for the Iraq War, so why not nuke Mexico City!" "Hey, you had sex with your wife, so why not have sex with this Donkey! You're pro-sex, aren't you!"
Legalizing Gay Marriage will not stop Heterosexuals from creating families, nor will it hinder ANY way, shape, or form, the time-honored tradition ( That you may one day experience ) of sticking your penis into a vagina or creating little bundles of baby shit, coo noises, and spitup.
Our society has never been "family" based. Our society was in fact crafted with the rights of the individual in mind. Absolutely nothing in our Declaration of Independence, Constitution, or Bill of Rights mentions families.
The role and purpose of the family is a social construct. It has nothing to do with the law or your 5th grade understanding of politics as Republican and Democrat Spy versus Spy.
The issue is not family, Poopy Shoes, its the fact that you are posting information that compromises, endangers, or subjects another person to financial or personal vulnerability. This falls under the same category as screaming "Fire" in a crowded building.
Your point A to point C argument is that since many "Liberals" dont believe in most censorship, the logical conclusion is that all censorship must be removed. This is like saying "Hey, you're for the Iraq War, so why not nuke Mexico City!" "Hey, you had sex with your wife, so why not have sex with this Donkey! You're pro-sex, aren't you!"
Legalizing Gay Marriage will not stop Heterosexuals from creating families, nor will it hinder ANY way, shape, or form, the time-honored tradition ( That you may one day experience ) of sticking your penis into a vagina or creating little bundles of baby shit, coo noises, and spitup.
Our society has never been "family" based. Our society was in fact crafted with the rights of the individual in mind. Absolutely nothing in our Declaration of Independence, Constitution, or Bill of Rights mentions families.
The role and purpose of the family is a social construct. It has nothing to do with the law or your 5th grade understanding of politics as Republican and Democrat Spy versus Spy.
How the fuck do Labor Laws hurt or hinder the American Family?
I am seriously laughing at this one tadou.
Does the large, cumbersome OSHA compliance manual get in the way of Daddy and Little Billy's playtime?
Funny, I thought a woman with a kid doesn't qualify as a family. You need a strong Christian head of the household before it's a family.
And dont worry tadou, when you get played by a man who gets the nonny and leaves I will be sure to keep you away from the Abortion clinics no matter how much you resist.
I am seriously laughing at this one tadou.
Does the large, cumbersome OSHA compliance manual get in the way of Daddy and Little Billy's playtime?
Funny, I thought a woman with a kid doesn't qualify as a family. You need a strong Christian head of the household before it's a family.
And dont worry tadou, when you get played by a man who gets the nonny and leaves I will be sure to keep you away from the Abortion clinics no matter how much you resist.
The thing I see wrong with the point you´re making is that when people are "family oriented" like you say, IT IS INDIVIDUALISM! If people are making decisions based on only their own family and not the whole community, that is individualism and selfishness. What sounds more like individualism; decisions people make to take care of their own family (RIGHT), or decisions made that are best for the whole community (LEFT)?
"It is human nature to protect your family, ABOVE ALL ELSE!"
It is human nature to protect everyone in the community, capitalism makes people worry about their family and no one else.
"It is human nature to protect your family, ABOVE ALL ELSE!"
It is human nature to protect everyone in the community, capitalism makes people worry about their family and no one else.
yes, however, putting someones personal information on to a T-shirt isnt free speech. so your example was flawed from the start.
because personal information does not constitute free speech, harry...
now try using an example where somebody isnt in danger of identity theft or being libel.. and your arguement falls to pieces...
What???? people who are in favor of abortion are only making up a scheme to aid free speech? thats the stupidest attempt at bashing a constitutional right ive ever heard...
*yawn*..
free speech is vital to a democracy.. if u want to get rid of it...you dont belong here in america kiddo.. i laugh at people like you who want to get rid of free speech because i PROMISEyou if this were a democratic president and he made an attempt to stop the lunatic right wing fringe from speaking out against the plethora of issues they seem to burden themselves with, i gaurentee that you would hide behind that freespeech and declare that democrap president as breaking the constitution.....
because personal information does not constitute free speech, harry...
now try using an example where somebody isnt in danger of identity theft or being libel.. and your arguement falls to pieces...
What???? people who are in favor of abortion are only making up a scheme to aid free speech? thats the stupidest attempt at bashing a constitutional right ive ever heard...
*yawn*..
free speech is vital to a democracy.. if u want to get rid of it...you dont belong here in america kiddo.. i laugh at people like you who want to get rid of free speech because i PROMISEyou if this were a democratic president and he made an attempt to stop the lunatic right wing fringe from speaking out against the plethora of issues they seem to burden themselves with, i gaurentee that you would hide behind that freespeech and declare that democrap president as breaking the constitution.....
Troll pretty much posted the shit I was gonna posted, Tadou you were far of from free speech. You can have free speech to a certain degree until you offend someone, remember the case of the Man with the Jacket that said Fuck the War, I forgot the case name, I did a debate in that class, and I was against the man with the jacket and I won.
Friend, my point about Free Speech and Family was that they are not as intuitively compatible as some would believe. To argue anything about censorship or weakening Free Speech rights is completely missing the point. This isn't about choosing one or the other; it's about realizing that such a distinction exists, and that the stronger Free Speech "is"....the Weaker the family gets. I'm not arguing one way or another, or arguing that weakening Free Speech would "strengthen" the family--I'm just pointing out the truth of the matter.
Whether you like it or not, Child Labor Laws are on the books. I cannot believe you can sit here and say things like, The Family is a "social constuct", and here.....the laws exist. They are tangible. We as a society don't want our 5 and 8 and 10 year old children working, REGARDLESS OF IF THEY ARE EASILY ABLE TO, OR "READY" TO, OR "NEED" TO DO SO. We set these kinds of minimum ages so that children will be compelled (if not required) to STAY HOME, with their FAMILIES, for longer periods of time. Not just because someone picked a number out of a hat, and decided to make X years the legal age to work, or to consent, or to drink, or anything else.
I'll end this by pointing out that, if you are going to accuse me of making threads about such-and-such, or discussing this-one-thing...........YOU NEED TO FIND THE THREADS OR COMMENTS. Not doing so, but still throwing out some weak-ass insult based on your flawed memory, is something you ought to be ashamed of.
Whether you like it or not, Child Labor Laws are on the books. I cannot believe you can sit here and say things like, The Family is a "social constuct", and here.....the laws exist. They are tangible. We as a society don't want our 5 and 8 and 10 year old children working, REGARDLESS OF IF THEY ARE EASILY ABLE TO, OR "READY" TO, OR "NEED" TO DO SO. We set these kinds of minimum ages so that children will be compelled (if not required) to STAY HOME, with their FAMILIES, for longer periods of time. Not just because someone picked a number out of a hat, and decided to make X years the legal age to work, or to consent, or to drink, or anything else.
I'll end this by pointing out that, if you are going to accuse me of making threads about such-and-such, or discussing this-one-thing...........YOU NEED TO FIND THE THREADS OR COMMENTS. Not doing so, but still throwing out some weak-ass insult based on your flawed memory, is something you ought to be ashamed of.
I never said Labor Laws hurt the family....I said the opposite. Are you even reading all of what I say, or just closing your eyes and typing blindly?
"The United States is based around the Family. Capitalism, the way we do it, is a Family Affair. If it wasn't, then there would be no such thing as child labor laws. There would be no 40-hour work-week. There would be no tax break for married people. There would be no child tax credit, and so on and so forth. The tax laws and labor laws we have on the books are to promote strong families."
Friend, do you ever go back and review what is said, just to make sure......or read once, and tell yourself you don't need to read it again because you've already memorized everything?
"The United States is based around the Family. Capitalism, the way we do it, is a Family Affair. If it wasn't, then there would be no such thing as child labor laws. There would be no 40-hour work-week. There would be no tax break for married people. There would be no child tax credit, and so on and so forth. The tax laws and labor laws we have on the books are to promote strong families."
Friend, do you ever go back and review what is said, just to make sure......or read once, and tell yourself you don't need to read it again because you've already memorized everything?
You have it backwards. It is human nature to protect your family, and worry about your closest peoples (grandmothers, aunts, etc. included); not everyone else's family (esp. other tribes/races), or the enviroment, or plants and animals.
INSTINCT tells us to protect our own. SOCIETY tells us to look after others. LAW (Tax, Labor, other) tells us that, if we produce our own children, we'll pay less taxes, have their schooling paid for/subsidized, etc etc.
Instinct + Law > Society. Two to One. The game has concluded, and there will be no rematch.
INSTINCT tells us to protect our own. SOCIETY tells us to look after others. LAW (Tax, Labor, other) tells us that, if we produce our own children, we'll pay less taxes, have their schooling paid for/subsidized, etc etc.
Instinct + Law > Society. Two to One. The game has concluded, and there will be no rematch.
"The more you think about this topic, the more you can understand why Liberals, Atheists and everyone else in the Left-wing camp want people to stop having families, want people to get more abortions, are strongly in favor of gay marriage, etc etc. They want a society based around the individual...not the family.
(...)
In reality.....they want to destroy the Family, and they are willing to trick us all using "Free Speech" (among other things) to do so."
Free Speech is one "Human Right" they use, as I have already explained. Abortion is another "Human Right" that Liberals like to use, that needs no explanation. And there are, of course, many others.
Conspicuously absent from the list: The Death Penalty. This is not as cut and dried as.....how can I put this...... this isn't as cut and dried as some people would have you believe that I believe. There we go.
(...)
In reality.....they want to destroy the Family, and they are willing to trick us all using "Free Speech" (among other things) to do so."
Free Speech is one "Human Right" they use, as I have already explained. Abortion is another "Human Right" that Liberals like to use, that needs no explanation. And there are, of course, many others.
Conspicuously absent from the list: The Death Penalty. This is not as cut and dried as.....how can I put this...... this isn't as cut and dried as some people would have you believe that I believe. There we go.
Personal information is very legal, and is very much free speech. At this moment, if I had your e-mail address or phone number, I could post it up right now and not be in violation of any laws. This happens all the time.
Talk show hosts get someone's number or e-mail address, give it out to all their listeners, then say clever things like "Now, don't go calling _____ and saying mean things.....if you're going to call them, then be courteous!"
An example without personal information? How about I post up a picture of where you live at? That is free speech as well. It isn't illegal to take pictures of houses. Is there something you're not understanding about my many different examples? Do you not see the common thread?
Absent malice or the intent to do harm, it is not always (nor is it commonly) illegal to share someone's personal information, pictures of their home, pictures of their family, pictures of them, or anything else personal to them.
In case you are still having problems putting this all together...... that malice or intent to do harm up ^^^^^ in there, mostly deals with children and families, and their protection. It's the same reason we have Barely 18 magazines with naked pictures...and not Barely 16 magazine with the same.
The more people harm themselves, the less likely they are to be able to create healthy families. Bottom line.
Talk show hosts get someone's number or e-mail address, give it out to all their listeners, then say clever things like "Now, don't go calling _____ and saying mean things.....if you're going to call them, then be courteous!"
An example without personal information? How about I post up a picture of where you live at? That is free speech as well. It isn't illegal to take pictures of houses. Is there something you're not understanding about my many different examples? Do you not see the common thread?
Absent malice or the intent to do harm, it is not always (nor is it commonly) illegal to share someone's personal information, pictures of their home, pictures of their family, pictures of them, or anything else personal to them.
In case you are still having problems putting this all together...... that malice or intent to do harm up ^^^^^ in there, mostly deals with children and families, and their protection. It's the same reason we have Barely 18 magazines with naked pictures...and not Barely 16 magazine with the same.
The more people harm themselves, the less likely they are to be able to create healthy families. Bottom line.
This last part needed its own section... Lol.
Let's go ahead and get this out of the way.....your scenario is shit.
I "want to get rid of free speech"......come again? Now you're just putting words into my mouth, creating a groundless argument, then running with it. Strawman Argument, I believe it's called...something like that. Don't feel like Wiki'ing to confirm.
As for your first line:
"free speech is vital to a democracy.. if u want to get rid of it...you dont belong here in america kiddo"
This is exactly the kind of shit I'm talking about. If one doesn't believe in unfettered Free Speech, or Abortion, or whatever other cause-du-jour--then they must not believe in Democracy. Haven't we heard this one before? Does "If you don't want to go after the Terrorists, you must hate America" ring a bell?
America is about the Family. Democracy (and Freedom as a whole) is about the individual who is able to create a good, strong family environment, find a mate and then reproduce in relative security, without being bothered any more than they would like to be bothered.
All this other shit you're talking is extraneous. Free Speech is meant to be a tool to allow people to say the things they feel the need to say (especially Anti-Government things).....the same way stubbing your toe, and yelling out "FUCK!!!!!!!!" make some people feel better than simply yelling out "Ouch". There is a certain taboo about the word Fuck, and being able to yell it with "good reason" that trumps the Ouch-yelling. But I digress.
It is that same kind of "good reason" that is absent many smut magazines and other such instruments of "free speech". It is the same reason one cannot conspire to destroy buildings or hurt cilvians, etc., and say you were "just talking" and didn't actually "do" anything.
As such, "Free Speech" isn't supposed to mean both "Free" and "Speech". Free Speech is that certain degree of latitude you are given to be able to shit-talk your government or other people without getting bitch-slapped back. Some degree of Free Speech is necessary for any Democracy....of course. But to simply state, for example, that we "need" more Free Speech.......that, my friend, is open to argument.
Let's go ahead and get this out of the way.....your scenario is shit.
I "want to get rid of free speech"......come again? Now you're just putting words into my mouth, creating a groundless argument, then running with it. Strawman Argument, I believe it's called...something like that. Don't feel like Wiki'ing to confirm.
As for your first line:
"free speech is vital to a democracy.. if u want to get rid of it...you dont belong here in america kiddo"
This is exactly the kind of shit I'm talking about. If one doesn't believe in unfettered Free Speech, or Abortion, or whatever other cause-du-jour--then they must not believe in Democracy. Haven't we heard this one before? Does "If you don't want to go after the Terrorists, you must hate America" ring a bell?
America is about the Family. Democracy (and Freedom as a whole) is about the individual who is able to create a good, strong family environment, find a mate and then reproduce in relative security, without being bothered any more than they would like to be bothered.
All this other shit you're talking is extraneous. Free Speech is meant to be a tool to allow people to say the things they feel the need to say (especially Anti-Government things).....the same way stubbing your toe, and yelling out "FUCK!!!!!!!!" make some people feel better than simply yelling out "Ouch". There is a certain taboo about the word Fuck, and being able to yell it with "good reason" that trumps the Ouch-yelling. But I digress.
It is that same kind of "good reason" that is absent many smut magazines and other such instruments of "free speech". It is the same reason one cannot conspire to destroy buildings or hurt cilvians, etc., and say you were "just talking" and didn't actually "do" anything.
As such, "Free Speech" isn't supposed to mean both "Free" and "Speech". Free Speech is that certain degree of latitude you are given to be able to shit-talk your government or other people without getting bitch-slapped back. Some degree of Free Speech is necessary for any Democracy....of course. But to simply state, for example, that we "need" more Free Speech.......that, my friend, is open to argument.