Tim Brown: The Raiders should select...

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Tony

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http://www.latimes.com/sports/footb...,4206186,print.story?coll=la-headlines-sports

Raiders beware
Oakland could draft LSU's Russell or Georgia Tech's Johnson with the NFL's top pick, but former receiver Brown is not sold on either
By Sam Farmer
Times Staff Writer

April 25, 2007

The NFL draft is three days away, and the Oakland Raiders are on the clock. Typically, they aren't saying much about which direction they're leaning, although the rampant speculation is they will use the No. 1 pick on Louisiana State quarterback JaMarcus Russell or Georgia Tech receiver Calvin Johnson.

But one of the best players in Raiders history has three little words of advice for his old team: Don't do it.

Retired receiver Tim Brown says he thinks it would be a big mistake for the Raiders to select either of those players, even though he thinks both have potential to excel.

"I think they should take Joe Thomas," Brown said, referring to the All-American left tackle from Wisconsin. "It's not the glamorous move, and it's not the splash everybody wants. But from a football point of view, I think it would make perfect sense for them to do that."

The Raiders, who haven't used a first-round pick on a skill-position player since drafting tight end Rickey Dudley in 1996, are coming off a 2-14 season in which they surrendered a league-worst 72 sacks. If they're skittish about spending such a high pick on an offensive lineman — one they'll have to pay in the neighborhood of $30 million guaranteed — it's probably because they selected tackle Robert Gallery second overall in 2004, and he has been a bust.

But the way Brown sees it, the 6-foot-6, 255-pound Russell could be equally disappointing if he is forced into action too soon. He sees the quarterback as a two-year project, and one who might never fit in the type of West Coast system that new Coach Lane Kiffin plans to run.

"I was on the sideline of the LSU game, and I saw the kid warming up," said Brown, referring to the Tigers' victory over Notre Dame in the Sugar Bowl. "I don't think he's Michael Vick, for sure, and I definitely don't think he's Vince Young….

"Yeah, I think [Russell] is a big guy, and he may be able to scramble once in a while, but that's not his forte. He's not a rhythm passer. He's a guy who likes to go back, pat the ball a couple of times and then get rid of the ball. In the NFL, and especially in the West Coast offense, you have to be a rhythm passer. You have to go back, and on your fifth step that ball has to be coming out."

Brown, a Heisman Trophy-winning receiver at Notre Dame who spent 17 seasons with the Raiders before retiring in 2005, said it would be smarter for Oakland to draft Fighting Irish quarterback Brady Quinn "but obviously no one is talking about that right now."

The Raiders, among the more secretive NFL teams, aren't saying much of anything about what they plan to do. There's always a chance they could trade down out of the top spot. There's been speculation that Tampa Bay, which picks fourth, and Denver, which picks 21st, might try to move up to draft Johnson.

However, a deal involving those teams and the Raiders seems highly unlikely for several reasons — among them, Buccaneers Coach Jon Gruden and Broncos Coach Mike Shanahan each coached the Raiders and strained feelings remain.

Other teams might reason, why trade up if we can stay where we are and get a good player — maybe the player we've wanted all along — for less money?

The top pick will get a big payday, of course, and all of the pressure that comes with it.

"Every day someone's going to expect you to do something great because of all the money and all the pressure that's on you," Kiffin said. "If it happened to be a quarterback, you've got to deal with the guy every week and you're going to get the questions. 'Are you ready to play? Why aren't you playing?' … So there's a lot of work to do off the field as well as on the field."

That's not to say Kiffin is tipping his hand. His tight-lipped approach heading into his first draft was typified by his comments last month when he was asked what the Raiders intended to do with the pick, and whether they might trade it.

"We have the No. 1 pick at this time," he said. "And if we do pick there, we'll either draft a guy on offense or defense. I cut off all the other questions with that. We don't need kickers. We're solid there."

People began connecting Russell-to-the-Raiders dots after he threw for 322 yards and scored three touchdowns in a 41-14 trouncing of Notre Dame in the Sugar Bowl.

Brown, for one, wasn't blown away by his performance.

"JaMarcus Russell went from wherever he was to No. 1 because of Notre Dame's defense," he said. "And nobody around here is going to tell me that Notre Dame's defense is a top-rated defense. If you look at what he did in that game, he went back, he ran around, and, 'Oh, this is Notre Dame, let me just throw a Hail Mary.' And his boys kept coming down with the passes. I don't know how a game like that would promote a guy so far up the ladder, but that's what happens. This is a hype league, and all this stuff is really about hype, so that doesn't surprise me.

"I do think he'll be a good player. I'm not saying he won't be. I just don't think he's ready the first year he walks into the league. I think Brady is more equipped to walk in and play the first day. And I think he will play faster than JaMarcus Russell, even if [Russell] comes to the Raiders."

Likewise, Brown says he doesn't think Johnson is an ideal fit for the Raiders, even though he called him "a guy who's going to be great no matter where he goes."

"But is Calvin Johnson a West Coast type of receiver? I don't really think that about him," he said. "I don't look at him as a pattern runner. I look at him as a Randy Moss-type guy. He's fast, big and can out-jump people. Can you conform him to a West Coast offense? Probably can. Will it happen overnight? Probably not."

The best solution in the short term, Brown said, is to keep quarterback Andrew Walter and improve his blockers.

"I don't know if they'll do that because they need some glamour right now," he said. "They need some hype. … [But] they have a quarterback in Walter that they can give another year to see if he's capable of getting something done. If he can't get it done, then you move on and say you need to get a quarterback next year."
 
Mar 16, 2005
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Tim Brown is trippin....bwhahahahahahahaha

Tony...you do realize that's what EVERYONE HERE, and ALOT OF SCOUTS, have been saying about russell since all this talk started!!!

he is NOT trippin!



hell he even says what I have been saying last year with cutler, and now with russell....qb is atleast 2 years away for a rookie to be starting
 
Jun 1, 2002
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thascary1 said:
Tim Brown is trippin....bwhahahahahahahaha

Tony...you do realize that's what EVERYONE HERE, and ALOT OF SCOUTS, have been saying about russell since all this talk started!!!

he is NOT trippin!



hell he even says what I have been saying last year with cutler, and now with russell....qb is atleast 2 years away for a rookie to be starting

USING THE PICK ON A TACKLE IS JUST AS HUGE A GAMBLE..


JUST LOOK AT ROBERT GALLERY.
 

Tony

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thascary 1, I am not even trying to turn this into a "draft Russell" thread because everyone knows that I think the Raiders should draft a QB with the first pick. But an offensive lineman with the first pick of the draft? So Tim Brown thinks that Walter is a west coast qb? I guess he must have missed that screen pass that Walter threw behind Jordan in that game against the 49ers. Walter is terrible in my opinion. I would draft a qb and give Walter a chance at starting... as soon as he starts screwing up I would put the rookie qb in.

And I don't buy into all that it takes a few years for a qb to develop. It probably does, but it's for the better and long term of the franchise. Jay Culter, Vince Young, and Matt Leinhart all started at some point in their rookie season and they didn't look all that bad. And they're all expected to start this season and lead their teams.
 

Tony

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thascary1 said:
qb is atleast 2 years away for a rookie to be starting
Huh? Big Ben started in his first year. Peyton Manning started his first year. Carson Palmer started his second year. Phillip Rivers probably would have started if it wasn't for Drew Brees. The first 3 qb's from last year started at some point in their rookie season. Alex Smith....
 
Mar 16, 2005
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Tony said:
Huh? Big Ben started in his first year. Peyton Manning started his first year. Carson Palmer started his second year. Phillip Rivers probably would have started if it wasn't for Drew Brees. The first 3 qb's from last year started at some point in their rookie season. Alex Smith....

YAWN........And out of all those qb's none did shit except Ben who had a great D around him.


Also you keep saying that cutler did good...HE WAS SHIT!!!!!! He had 1 great pass in 6 games..ONE!

outside of that he was shit
 

Tony

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#9
I totally disagree about Cutler. He threw 9 Td's and 5 Int's. He completed 60% of his passes and his qb rating was respectable for a vet. LOL at 1 great pass in 6 games.

What about Vince Young? The Titans went 8-5 with him starting!
 
Mar 16, 2005
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Tony said:
I totally disagree about Cutler. He threw 9 Td's and 5 Int's. He completed 60% of his passes and his qb rating was respectable for a vet. LOL at 1 great pass in 6 games.

What about Vince Young? The Titans went 8-5 with him starting!
no playoffs for Young......and you obviously didn't watch cutler and are kjust going off stats, so in that case I will drop this convo because it will go no where when you look just at that!

also noone of the qb's you mentioned went to playoffs thier first year except ben and you still want to argue this point??
 
Apr 7, 2007
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really tho you cant juss rush alot of these qb's into the pros it is way faster in the nfl than college shit takes time so 2 years or even 3 to get a qb adjusted to the league is the right thing to do look at some good qb's in college who aint do shit in the pros because they were rushed or wasnt ready for the game speed todd marinovich andre ware ty detmer. comin from a receiver to me what he is sayin makes since
 

Tony

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I hear you Norcal916... but even it did take a few years to develop a qb I think it's worth the investment. But then Tim says that draft a tackle now and if Andrew Walter doesn't work out then draft a qb next year. To me that's wasting time. That's going to set us back another year. I think they should go ahead and draft a qb since they have an opportunity to with the first overall pick in the draft. But a lineman? Come on Timmy....
 
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Tony said:
I hear you Norcal916... but even it did take a few years to develop a qb I think it's worth the investment. But then Tim says that draft a tackle now and if Andrew Walter doesn't work out then draft a qb next year. To me that's wasting time. That's going to set us back another year. I think they should go ahead and draft a qb since they have an opportunity to with the first overall pick in the draft. But a lineman? Come on Timmy....


without getting an o-line estabished it doesn't matter what QB you get. you could have fucking Jim Plunkett back, it wont matter.
 
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they have been improving the o line i say get a qb either quinn or russell, quinn said it would be a dream to play on tha brownz and im sure russell wont be no superman his rookie yr but he can get use to the west coast offence and get better, yall think quinn can do good w tha west coast offence?
 
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KOOL_AID said:
they have been improving the o line i say get a qb either quinn or russell, quinn said it would be a dream to play on tha brownz and im sure russell wont be no superman his rookie yr but he can get use to the west coast offence and get better, yall think quinn can do good w tha west coast offence?

so you improved the o-line by getting an injury prone old guy and a very mediocre scrub from Denver?


NICE!
 
Mar 16, 2005
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KOOL_AID said:
they have been improving the o line i say get a qb either quinn or russell, quinn said it would be a dream to play on tha brownz and im sure russell wont be no superman his rookie yr but he can get use to the west coast offence and get better, yall think quinn can do good w tha west coast offence?

I think Quinn would be a way better fit than Russell, I agree with the article and what tim brown says about russell
 
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i think having run the pro style offense the las couple of years at notre dame will help him be more prepared for the nfl than russell i think quinn would take his bumps and bruises but i think he could succeed in it if taught by the right coach what brown was sayin makes since tho bout the notre dame game i mean look at what michigan did to notre dame when they played virtually walked all over them if russell would have done that to usc ohio state florida texas maimi florida state or michigan then okay he could truly be considered a great number one pick. i choose those schools because they usaully have good defenses not on what they did last year all though a few did have really good defense last year
 

Tony

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#19
I think Quinn could work in the west coast offense... I think both Qb's (Russell and Quinn) can. I think Timmy sort of contradicted himself by saying Russell won't be able to work in the west coast offense and that Walter would be able to. Walter is a statue with no pocket awareness... he doesn't have a sense for the pressure. When the pressure is on that's when Walter is at his worst.

I also disagree with Timmy in regards to CJ as well... Tim act like he's Bill Walsh (the inventor of the West Coast Offense). How does he know who and who wouldn't fit in that system?
 

Tony

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#20
Norcal916 said:
i think having run the pro style offense the las couple of years at notre dame will help him be more prepared for the nfl than russell i think quinn would take his bumps and bruises but i think he could succeed in it if taught by the right coach what brown was sayin makes since tho bout the notre dame game i mean look at what michigan did to notre dame when they played virtually walked all over them if russell would have done that to usc ohio state florida texas maimi florida state or michigan then okay he could truly be considered a great number one pick. i choose those schools because they usaully have good defenses not on what they did last year all though a few did have really good defense last year
You've got good points but LSU is in the SEC. And from what I hear, the SEC maybe the toughest conference in college football or one of the toughest. Quinn does have the experience over Russell. I think both will be good qb's. But once developed, I think Russell could turn out to be the better pro.

Cleveland should snatch Quinn with the 3rd pick if they want to contend in the future.