Boxing News Thread
- Thread starter heyzel
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mosley went 12 full rounds against floyd too that doesn't mean he's top 10 p4p. Most guys go 12 rounds against floyd.
Other than fighting great against Pacquiao he hasn't done anything that great or amazing in the past few years. he got shut out against floyd (no shame there whatsoever), fought a bum in Likar Ramos, beat Michael Katsidis which is a good/decent win but not great, beat Juan Diaz twice which is about the same or maybe slightly above Katsidis, beat an old Casamayor and an old Barrera and before that lost to Chris John, so really he hasn't fought the best opponents out there. He hasn't done what Pacquiao & Floyd have done, which is achieve true greatness.
Basically what I'm saying is you can't have marquez at 2 above Pacquiao just because he performed great against Pac. Jermain Taylor beat Bernard Hopkins who was ranked #1 in a super close controversial fight but that didn't make Taylor #1 in the world and hell, he got the official win.
Other than fighting great against Pacquiao he hasn't done anything that great or amazing in the past few years. he got shut out against floyd (no shame there whatsoever), fought a bum in Likar Ramos, beat Michael Katsidis which is a good/decent win but not great, beat Juan Diaz twice which is about the same or maybe slightly above Katsidis, beat an old Casamayor and an old Barrera and before that lost to Chris John, so really he hasn't fought the best opponents out there. He hasn't done what Pacquiao & Floyd have done, which is achieve true greatness.
Basically what I'm saying is you can't have marquez at 2 above Pacquiao just because he performed great against Pac. Jermain Taylor beat Bernard Hopkins who was ranked #1 in a super close controversial fight but that didn't make Taylor #1 in the world and hell, he got the official win.
That's a shame Marquez is fighting Cuenca. I've seen Cuenca's fights that got televised on TYC and the only one I saw against someone that could actually fight they gave him the decision anyway (De Jesus) and if I remember right they gave it to him pretty wide. All the options out there for a guy like Marquez and this is what he does ..
that's funny man I was just about to edit my post and say, "I wonder if I can finally stump naner, maybe this is the one guy he has never heard of!"
Yeah I heard the De Jesus fight was controversial, which is the only guy I vaguely recognize on his resume. Correct me if I'm wrong but he's in prison now but was a pretty well respected puerto rican prospect at one point.
Anyways, I have no idea how the WBO can have Cuenca ranked #1. That's a head scratcher. They have him above matthysse, holt, soto, and a number of other guys. I guess they are trying to do JMM a solid and just want that % of the fight purse. Feed him a bum and hope he fights pacquiao a fourth time later (who no surprise has a WBO belt).
Yeah I heard the De Jesus fight was controversial, which is the only guy I vaguely recognize on his resume. Correct me if I'm wrong but he's in prison now but was a pretty well respected puerto rican prospect at one point.
Anyways, I have no idea how the WBO can have Cuenca ranked #1. That's a head scratcher. They have him above matthysse, holt, soto, and a number of other guys. I guess they are trying to do JMM a solid and just want that % of the fight purse. Feed him a bum and hope he fights pacquiao a fourth time later (who no surprise has a WBO belt).
De Jesus is in prison and that stands as his lone loss against Cuenca. One thing that's pretty cool the prison that he's in has a program where he, and other boxers in that prison, can take fights outside of prison if their behavior inside is good. It's a rehabilitation program. His last fight was actually while he was incarcerated.
As for Cuenca, the De Jesus fight was actually supposed to be a mandatory title fight at the time and I think the guy has kind of been shut out of the picture since. I'm not saying he's great but he's fought every garbage WBO title fight and silly eliminator they've put him in and he's never officially lost. I wouldn't mind it if he was getting a shot at any 140lb title at all, I mind that Marquez doesn't have much time left, is coming off a fight against Pacquiao which made him look good yet again and he should be able to pick and choose opponents at this point in his career. Cuenca doesn't have a title at the weight, he's not a name, and I don't think he's very popular in his home country.
Doesn't make sense to me.
As for Cuenca, the De Jesus fight was actually supposed to be a mandatory title fight at the time and I think the guy has kind of been shut out of the picture since. I'm not saying he's great but he's fought every garbage WBO title fight and silly eliminator they've put him in and he's never officially lost. I wouldn't mind it if he was getting a shot at any 140lb title at all, I mind that Marquez doesn't have much time left, is coming off a fight against Pacquiao which made him look good yet again and he should be able to pick and choose opponents at this point in his career. Cuenca doesn't have a title at the weight, he's not a name, and I don't think he's very popular in his home country.
Doesn't make sense to me.
The Chris John fight was in johns home country and was close, and mayweather showed up heavy to the fight, not that jmm had much of a chance. Still, no need to talk about mosely or any other fighters, the fact that is that jmm is at least on the same tier as pac right below mayweather and until pac fights pbf I give the edge to marquez. That's just my opinion and nothing else.
Khan to train with Gallagher for a couple of weeks to get ready for Peterson rematch
February 15th, 2012
By Sean McDaniel: Former IBF/WBA light welterweight champion Amir Khan will be working out with trainer Joe Gallagher for a couple of weeks rather than flying to the United States to start training with Freddie Roach at the Wildcard Gym in Los Angeles, California.
According to Manchester Evening News, Khan will join up with trainer Roach in the Philippines so that Roach can train both Manny Pacquiao and Khan at different times. Roach is getting Pacquiao ready for his June 9th fight against Timothy Bradley.
Khan faces IBF/WBA light welterweight champion Lamont Peterson on May 19th at the Mandalay Bay Resort & Casino in Las Vegas, Nevada.
Khan’s business manager Asif Valli told the Manchester evening news, “Rather than have a short camp in the U.S, he [Khan] will start his initial training camp with Joe Gallagher. It’s the first time he’s starting in the UK, but the dates don’t work and Manny is the first in Freddie Roach’s contract.”
Gallagher has done well training the likes of Anthony Crolla, Matthew Macklin, Scott Quigg, Martin Murray and Stephen Smith in the UK. It’ll be interesting to see if Gallagher can give Khan some new tools to use for him to find success against Peterson in their May 19th rematch.
Gallagher trained fighters are known for having excellent uppercuts in close and that’s something that Khan really needs for him to excel against Peterson. Khan looked out of his element against Peterson while being pressured on the inside and used a lot of holding and pushing off rather than throwing uppercuts or trying to fight.
Gallagher hopefully can give Khan some tools to where he can succeed. He won’t have a lot of time to work with Khan unfortunately, but if Khan is a fast learn then perhaps he can take in enough from there short time working that he can still use it to his benefit against Peterson.
February 15th, 2012
By Sean McDaniel: Former IBF/WBA light welterweight champion Amir Khan will be working out with trainer Joe Gallagher for a couple of weeks rather than flying to the United States to start training with Freddie Roach at the Wildcard Gym in Los Angeles, California.
According to Manchester Evening News, Khan will join up with trainer Roach in the Philippines so that Roach can train both Manny Pacquiao and Khan at different times. Roach is getting Pacquiao ready for his June 9th fight against Timothy Bradley.
Khan faces IBF/WBA light welterweight champion Lamont Peterson on May 19th at the Mandalay Bay Resort & Casino in Las Vegas, Nevada.
Khan’s business manager Asif Valli told the Manchester evening news, “Rather than have a short camp in the U.S, he [Khan] will start his initial training camp with Joe Gallagher. It’s the first time he’s starting in the UK, but the dates don’t work and Manny is the first in Freddie Roach’s contract.”
Gallagher has done well training the likes of Anthony Crolla, Matthew Macklin, Scott Quigg, Martin Murray and Stephen Smith in the UK. It’ll be interesting to see if Gallagher can give Khan some new tools to use for him to find success against Peterson in their May 19th rematch.
Gallagher trained fighters are known for having excellent uppercuts in close and that’s something that Khan really needs for him to excel against Peterson. Khan looked out of his element against Peterson while being pressured on the inside and used a lot of holding and pushing off rather than throwing uppercuts or trying to fight.
Gallagher hopefully can give Khan some tools to where he can succeed. He won’t have a lot of time to work with Khan unfortunately, but if Khan is a fast learn then perhaps he can take in enough from there short time working that he can still use it to his benefit against Peterson.
I bring up Chris John because outside of fighting Pacquiao real good and getting shut out against Floyd, what has Marquez done over the past 4-5 years really? He doesn't have any GREAT wins to be honest. Good wins (katsidis, Diaz) but nothing great.
I think the simple fact he's fighting guys like Cuenca and Likar Ramos should tell you he's not a #2 pound 4 pound fighter. Imagine if Pac or Floyd fought some guys like that, they would be the joke of boxing. Marquez should be acting like a top 2-3 fighter, not wasting time with no names. Pac is fighting the #1 JW in Bradley. Floyd is fighting the #1 JMW. Marquez is fighting a bum beater with 1 KO in 42 fights.
I think the simple fact he's fighting guys like Cuenca and Likar Ramos should tell you he's not a #2 pound 4 pound fighter. Imagine if Pac or Floyd fought some guys like that, they would be the joke of boxing. Marquez should be acting like a top 2-3 fighter, not wasting time with no names. Pac is fighting the #1 JW in Bradley. Floyd is fighting the #1 JMW. Marquez is fighting a bum beater with 1 KO in 42 fights.
he fought pac & floyd but didn't fight the best at 135/140. He turns down big fights like against Amir Khan, Guerrero, Rios and guys like that. Not sure why you say pac is ducking when both floyd & pac didn't make the fight happen (pac wasn't thrilled with a may 5th date and floyd wouldn't accept a 50/50 split).
Marquez' win over Casa should be held in a higher light. Casa was the lineal champion, he had just beat KO'd Katsidis in a FOTY candidate in a fight that everyone was picking him to get crushed to retain his lineal championship and Marquez was moving up a weight class to do it after another tough fight with Pacquiao which some people believe he won.
it's a good win naner but not a great win. Casa was most definitely past prime. I didn't think he looked that good against Katsidis besides that sweet knockdown near the end and most everyone looks good against Katsidis. Prior to that Casamayor had that terrible performance in a blatant robbery against Santa Cruz, so while he technically was champ he most certainly didn't deserve to be one. That decision was worse than Lara vs Williams.
At the time people weren't looking good against Katsidis. He was supposed to go in there and beat old man Casa down. At the time all this happened they were saying Juan Diaz was the best in the division, rightfully so before the Campbell loss, Katsidis was known as an all action killer, Casa was the old lineal champion who just got a bullshit decision over Santa Cruz and Marquez hadn't even entered the division.
Say what you want about Diaz/Katsidis now at the time when Casa crushed his face people were claiming them to takeover the division. You can't judge wins in hindsight and Casa was a very good win considering the implications and moving up in weight if not a great win.
Say what you want about Diaz/Katsidis now at the time when Casa crushed his face people were claiming them to takeover the division. You can't judge wins in hindsight and Casa was a very good win considering the implications and moving up in weight if not a great win.
I'm not taking wins in hindsight I don't remember much hype around Katsidis other than the HBO people saying Katsidis was going to be the next Arturo Gatti. People weren't saying he was going to be a killer or a beast people were saying he was going to be awesome to watch (which has always been true with him). The only guys he beat prior to fighting Casa was Czar Amonsot (who did the below to his face) and Graham Earl.
Anyways, Katsidis is besides the point. I just don't see how Casamayor can be considered a great win for JMM considering he was past it. Yes he got the win over Katsidis that doesn't change the fact that Casamayor was not in his prime nor should he have even been champion.
Anyways, Katsidis is besides the point. I just don't see how Casamayor can be considered a great win for JMM considering he was past it. Yes he got the win over Katsidis that doesn't change the fact that Casamayor was not in his prime nor should he have even been champion.
Likor Ramos and Cesar Cuenca are risks? Marquez didn't demand catchweight fights against Floyd & Pac III?
You're telling me Pac fighting Morales, Barrera, going up from 135 to 147 to fight Oscar, fighting Cotto, fighting big guys at 140 & 147 aren't risks? Now you're just being stupid.
Compare resumes and you tell me who took more risks over recent years:
JMM:
Cesar Rene Cuenca
Likar Ramos
Michael Katsidis
Floyd Mayweather Jr
Juan Diaz
Juan Diaz
Rocky Juarez
Jimrex Jaca
Chris John
Pac:
Timothy Bradley
Shane Mosley
Antonio Margarito
Joshua Clottey
Miguel Cotto
Ricky Hatton
Oscar De La Hoya
David Diaz
Marco Antonio Barrera
Erik Morales
Jorge Solis
You're telling me Pac fighting Morales, Barrera, going up from 135 to 147 to fight Oscar, fighting Cotto, fighting big guys at 140 & 147 aren't risks? Now you're just being stupid.
Compare resumes and you tell me who took more risks over recent years:
JMM:
Cesar Rene Cuenca
Likar Ramos
Michael Katsidis
Floyd Mayweather Jr
Juan Diaz
Juan Diaz
Rocky Juarez
Jimrex Jaca
Chris John
Pac:
Timothy Bradley
Shane Mosley
Antonio Margarito
Joshua Clottey
Miguel Cotto
Ricky Hatton
Oscar De La Hoya
David Diaz
Marco Antonio Barrera
Erik Morales
Jorge Solis