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May 13, 2002
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www.socialistworld.net
#1
Thu Dec 23, 3:24 PM ET Science - AP


By PAUL ELIAS, AP Biotechnology Writer

SAN FRANCISCO - The first cloned-to-order pet sold in the United States is named Little Nicky, a 9-week-old kitten delivered to a Texas woman saddened by the loss of a cat she had owned for 17 years.



The kitten cost its owner $50,000 and was created from DNA from her beloved cat, named Nicky, who died last year.


"He is identical. His personality is the same," the owner, Julie, told The Associated Press in a telephone interview. Although she agreed to be photographed with her cat, she asked that her last name and hometown not be disclosed because she said she fears being targeted by groups opposed to cloning.


Yet while Little Nicky, who was delivered two weeks ago, frolics in his new home, the kitten's creation and sale has reignited fierce ethical and scientific debate over cloning technology, which is rapidly advancing.


The company that created Little Nicky, Sausalito-based Genetic Savings and Clone, said it hopes by May to have produced the world's first cloned dog — a much more lucrative market than cats.


While it is based in the San Francisco Bay area, the company's cloning work will be done at its new lab in Madison, Wis.


Commercial interests already are cloning prized cattle for about $20,000 each, and scientists have cloned mice, rabbits, goats, pigs, horses — and even the endangered banteng, a wild bull that is found mostly in Indonesia.


Several research teams around the world, meanwhile, are racing to create the first cloned monkey.


Aside from human cloning, which has been achieved only at the microscopic embryo stage, no cloning project has fueled more debate than the marketing plans of Genetic Savings and Clone.


"It's morally problematic and a little reprehensible," said David Magnus, co-director of the Center for Biomedical Ethics at Stanford University. "For $50,000, she could have provided homes for a lot of strays."


Animals rights activists complain that new feline production systems aren't needed because thousands of stray cats are euthanized each year for want of homes.


Lou Hawthorne, Genetic Savings and Clone's chief executive, said his company purchases thousands of ovaries from spay clinics across the country. It extracts the eggs, which are combined with the genetic material from the animals to be cloned.


Critics also complain that the technology is available only to the wealthy, that using it to create house pets is frivolous and that customers grieving over lost pets have unrealistic expectations of what they're buying.


In fact, the first cat cloned in 2001 had a different coat from its genetic donor, underscoring that environment and other biological variables make it impossible to exactly duplicate animals.


"The thing that many people do not realize is that the cloned cat is not the same as the original," said Bonnie Beaver, a Texas A&M animal behaviorist who heads the American Veterinary Medical Association, which has no position on the issue. "It has a different personality. It has different life experiences. They want Fluffy, but it's not Fluffy."


Scientists also warn that cloned animals suffer from more health problems than their traditionally bred peers and that cloning is still a very inexact science. It takes many gruesome failures to produce just a single clone.


Genetic Savings and Clone said its new cloning technique, developed by animal cloning pioneer James Robl has improved survival rates, health and appearance. The new technique seeks to condense and transfer only the donor's genetic material to a surrogate's egg instead of an entire cell nucleus.





Between 15 percent and 45 percent of cloned cats born alive die within the first 30 days, Hawthorne said. But he said that range is consistent with natural births, depending on the breed of cat.

Austin, Texas-based ViaGen Inc., which has cloned hundreds of cows, pigs and goats, also is experimenting with the new cloning technique.

"The jury is still out, but the research shows it to be promising," company president Sara Davis said. "The technology is improving all the time."

Genetic Savings and Clone has been behind the creation of at least five cats since 2001, including the first one created.

It hopes to deliver as many as five more clones to customers who have paid the company's $50,000 fee. By the end of next year, it hopes to have cloned as many as 50 cats.

The company has yet to turn a profit.
 
May 13, 2002
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#2
Like I've stated before, it's only a matter of time before parents have the option to pick their unborn childs height, eye color, body structure, hair color etc. As in this case with the cat, it will only be availible to the rich people....at first.

In the long run (say a few centuries from now) it is it is likely that neither the human race nor any other important organisms will exist as we know them today, because once you start modifying organisms through genetic engineering there is no reason to stop at any particular point, so that the modifications will probably continue until man and other organisms have been utterly transformed.

178. Whatever else may be the case, it is certain that technology is creating for human begins a new physical and social environment radically different from the spectrum of environments to which natural selection has adapted the human race physically and psychological. If man is not adjust to this new environment by being artificially re-engineered, then he will be adapted to it through a long an painful process of natural selection. The former is far more likely that the latter.
 
Nov 24, 2003
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#3
Absolutely....First it will start with health issues. Fixing problems so children don't have down syndrome, asthma, leukemia ect, ect. Then someone will say "well if I can fix these health problems why can't I make sure my child doesn't develope weight problems, or has clear skin." From there we will be dicussing issues of height, hair color, and intelligence. This whole thing will turn into a nasty snowball, that by the time its near the bottom, we will be staring at an avalanche.
 
May 14, 2002
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yup and then it willbe a matter of cost of who can make thier kid the best and it will be an even easier way to keep the poor poor and the rich rich....
 
Jul 10, 2002
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^^^^
Bullet proof cats, that'd be off the hook, lol

It's crazy, I'm not sure where I stand on this issue, like every other miraculous invention of modern science it can have such great & properous uses, or it can be utilized for greed and malign intent...

hmmmm...... All I know is we need to be involved in collaboration on how this tech. will be regulated... we should all be able to watch who is cloning what at ALL times, no doubt!
 

M-1

Sicc OG
Apr 25, 2002
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#9
interestinG you mention the eye color thinG...a friend of mine was doinG some research with a professor on campus and the topic of his research was Gettin cells that could reporduce like viruses in order to chanGe Genetic thinGs such as eye color and possibly other attributes...but it's not just for babies, it's for anyone who wanted to chanGe their eye color, weird shit
 
May 13, 2002
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www.socialistworld.net
#10
I’m kind of torn. Of course, advancing the human species would be great and I’m sure the next step in human evolution will be done by our doings, but on the other hand I can definitely see this sort of science abused, especially in capitalist America. When Capitalism has outlived its useful purpose, as it has clearly done, the forces of production can very easily turn into the forces of destruction.
 
Jun 17, 2004
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#11
2-0-Sixx said:
I’m kind of torn. Of course, advancing the human species would be great and I’m sure the next step in human evolution will be done by our doings, but on the other hand I can definitely see this sort of science abused, especially in capitalist America. When Capitalism has outlived its useful purpose, as it has clearly done, the forces of production can very easily turn into the forces of destruction.
Think if insurance companies got a DNA make-up of every person. This would mean they could determine what health problems the person would have. Think of how much insurance companies would abuse this power.

Then factor in they are able to also change the DNA, it would leave poor people without the money to do so even poorer and the rich people with enough money to change the DNA would leave them with less health insurance to pay.
 
Oct 14, 2004
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#13
I dont see this cloning taking place in humans to fix genes only as organ reproduction. Sure you will have the group that will want to have perfect children and that cant be done %100. Sure if they do cause them to not get a certain virus maybe but that just means that new viruses will be formed in the process. Plus the actually of a perfect child isnt even %100. This is a fad that will happen for a little while but people will get tired of it and move on to something else.
 
Mar 13, 2003
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#14
SOAK::GAME said:
$50,000?? that cat better be bulletproof or something....
It's amazing what some people will do for pussy.

I can't believe a place that advanced in science/technology would have such a Looney Tunes ACME name... Genetic Savings and Clone, get the fuck out of here.
 
Mar 13, 2003
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www.billythefridge.com
#15
2-0-Sixx said:
I’m kind of torn. Of course, advancing the human species would be great and I’m sure the next step in human evolution will be done by our doings, but on the other hand I can definitely see this sort of science abused, especially in capitalist America. When Capitalism has outlived its useful purpose, as it has clearly done, the forces of production can very easily turn into the forces of destruction.
Everyone will be born with a Commercial Advertisement tatooed onto their body... "Brought to you by Time/Warner Pediatrics an AOL Division".
 
May 13, 2002
49,944
47,801
113
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Seattle
www.socialistworld.net
#16
http://www.savingsandclone.com/

This is the site of the company who offers cloning services, located in San Francisco..."The bay is back The back is back!"

"Genetic Savings & Clone enriches the lives of pet lovers through superior cloning technologies. Cat cloning available today; dog cloning available in 2005."



"WELCOME... to Genetic Savings & Clone, the world's leader in the cloning of exceptional pets. Cloning is the most precise method of duplicating a pet — both for appearance and behavioral tendencies. Our technology is the most advanced available — far more so than that used to produce Dolly, CC and other famous clones."
 
Jul 21, 2004
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Wouldn’t it be tight if those scientist and doctors could be accessible to assist in hospitals and countries who are in dire need of doctors for the sick and dying?

oh well, priorities. i'd prefer for a limited use of medical professions to research cloning while a larger majority are in hospitals.
 
Jul 21, 2004
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#20
this weekend i thought there must be some loop whole in our system that denies corporations limitation. i found but one......

The 5th Amendment to the Constitution state that no person shall be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use without just compensation.

examining all ways of looking at it. The people have the right to property. well...if policies are created for the people, we should make sure everyone is entitle to land property (w/limit) without payment toward anyone. And if the public deem it undeniable for some private property to be take for the sake of providing property for the people, then we stop the corporations from increasing profit by their cash flow of land property.