PB Wolf Interview

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Jake

Jake

Sicc OG
#1
May 1, 2003
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#1
since i put the madlib one might as well put this one up too...

Stop Smiling: When you started Stones Throw, what was your idea for what you wanted the label to be?

Peanut Butter Wolf: I was 15 when I first wanted to start a label; I got serious about it when I was 20. At that time, major labels had taken over - a lot of my favorite music was being made on majors and pseudo-majors like Jive and Elektra. Then there was this “independent renaissance” in the mid-'90s, in '95-'96, when I started.

In the beginning, Stones Throw was gonna be straight-up hip-hop. I'd been a record collector from age 12. I'd always search out weird electro, look for obscure labels, making the connections between labels, getting stuff out of out of Miami, out of Detroit, finding Schoolly D 12 inches. I'd buy records, make mix-tapes for people. I wanted to make mixes different from everyone else's. I wanted to show everyone what I found, show people music they'd never heard. So I think the label developed from that kind of attitude.

SS: How much does the West Coast locale influence the Stones Throw ethos?

PBW: It's influenced it more than I initially realized. For me, when I'd make mix-tapes, one side would be all N.Y. hip-hop: UTFO, Whodini, Run DMC. Then the flip side was all L.A.: “Egyptian Lover,” all the electro stuff. Back then the West Coast was fast, and New York was funk. But as we got the label going, I think the mellow vibe had an effect - the weed-smoking stuff, even though I don't smoke weed. The West Coast is about bass, everyone driving the cars with woofers. The East Coast is walkmans.

SS: L.A. is about the car culture.

PBW: Right. Everything I listen to, I listen to in the car, to make sure it passes the bass test. If I make another album, I'm gonna call it “Car Test.”

SS: Has running the label interfered with your own music making at all? Do you feel it's been pushed aside?

PBW: I don't know if it's the label, but at some point I just lost interest. Other than being an executive producer, watching over the mixing and everything. Wanting to sit down and just make a beat myself, those days have been over for a while.

SS: The label formed to release “Bronx-influenced” Bay Area tracks, but after eight years it's developed a feel all its own. What kind of ingredients have made up the label's sound?

PBW: I think being able to travel, to visit record stores all over the world, we've incorporated a lot of different styles. I was also listening to Gang Starr's Daily Operation the other day, and was surprised by how much that really influenced us. The simplicity, how raw it is, really dirty sounding. Step into the Arena, too, the real short songs. A lot of scratching. Premier gets all the attention, but Guru's really underrated, and the two of them together is just awesome. With Madlib you can hear all the stuff he's absorbed. What he did with Yesterday's New Quintet, all the jazz records.
 
Jake

Jake

Sicc OG
#2
May 1, 2003
9,427
154
63
44
#2
SS: Besides record collecting, what have been the other influences on the Stones Throw ethos?

PBW: For me, the beat digging is a big part of it. Listening to other records, seeing how they were recorded. Listening to the Gary Wilson album, understanding the process that produced that record. You listen to You Think You Really Know Me and it's so warm, the way he miked the drums is so warm. That sub-bass is so hip-hop. I generally like to describe the music I like as low-fi.

SS: How did you first meet Madlib? What effect did Madlib have on the direction of the label when he first came aboard?

PBW: I heard the Lootpack 12” on the radio when I was in my car. I pulled over and called up the station and the DJ gave me the phone number on the record. I called up and it was Madlib's dad [soul singer and musician Otis Jackson, Sr.]. He hooked me up with the group. They had an album already recorded, basement-style. We recorded it again in L.A. at Kutmasta Kurt's. We wanted to take it from the walkman to the vehicle, I guess [laughs].

Madlib gave me some tapes to listen to and they had all this stuff on them: Lootpack songs, instrumentals, Oh No, Medaphoar, Declaime, everything. The Quasimoto songs were at the end of one tape, and when I told Madlib about it he said, “Oh shit, you weren't supposed to hear that.” But when I told him I wanted to release that album, he was with it. He could do anything he wanted after that. So he started up on this jazz album, looping samples, then playing over them. He went to a music store, brought back all these instruments: keyboards, Fender Rhodes, vibes. He just sat down and taught himself to play from scratch. His playing was unconventional, but he somehow made all the instruments work his way. That really blew me away, they way he just sat down and did it. He would record vibes in the kitchen. I just always wanted to hear what he was gonna do next.

SS: What makes Madlib unique?

PBW: He's not judgmental. When I was making music, I'd spend a ton of time on just one song. He just does them in 20 minutes and moves on to the next. He leaves them sloppy - that's his style, that's the way he likes it. He's not afraid of being judged. I mean, to buy a bunch of foreign instruments, teach yourself how to play them, and let it be released on a record? To do an album of Stevie Wonder songs? He's just fearless.

SS: Did Stevie dig Stevie [the album of Wonder covers Madlib released under his Yesterday's New Quintet alias]?

PBW: I'm not sure he ever heard it. I can tell you that once I was eating at a restaurant in Beverly Hills with my sister, and there were celebrities everywhere. We get in the elevator with Keanu Reeves, Charles Barkley's at a table, and, oh shit, there's Stevie Wonder at the next table! I gotta tell him about Madlib's album. He's at the next table, I don't want to interrupt his dinner. I had a copy of Shades of Blue in the car, so I grabbed that. He gets up to leave with his manger, and I follow him into the bathroom. And there's, Stevie at the urinal. I told his manager, “I have an album that I want Stevie Wonder to hear, a cover album of all his music.” He says, “This isn't the time or place for this.” Then Stevie calls manager over, and the manager leaves. I asked Stevie if he'd heard of Madlib and he said no. But he'd heard of John Faddis [Madlib's uncle]. I told him Madlib's his nephew, that he experimenting with jazz. I showed him the cover of the Blue Note album, then remembered he can't see [laughs]. I never found out if he checked out the record.

SS: You've said that Stones Throw puts out music that you like, not music that you think other people will like. Have you had to change this method at all as the label's audience has expanded?

PBW: Yeah. Well, with the Gary Wilson album [You Think You Really Know Me], for instance, I really wanted to put it out. He liked what the label was doing and basically gave us that album, even though it didn't do that well for his career, or for the label. I thought the Gary Wilson album was one of the best albums of the year. He's what N*E*R*D should be sounding like now, or what some Outkast stuff sounds like. And those are million-sellers. I thought at least 10,000 people would like the new record. It's strange. Before the album came out, I was talking to ?uestlove about Gary, and he loved it, he was saying that he wanted to do an album with Gary. So, I was getting a really positive initial reaction from people before it came out, and thought it would change music when it was released. But it's sold nearly nothing.

It seems like a lot of our fans are not as open as what I would think. Maybe I just overestimated my own taste in music, that the fans are going to like what I like. With the DJ Rels album, too. I thought that was great, and it just came and went, without anyone saying anything.
 
Jake

Jake

Sicc OG
#3
May 1, 2003
9,427
154
63
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#3
SS: What kind of image do you think the general record-buying public has of Stones Throw?

PBW: That's what I don't really understand anymore. There's some Stones Throw fans that like Wildchild but wouldn't like DJ Rels, and some that would like a Rels and not a Wildchild. Quasimoto and Madvillain people identified with the most, and those are real psychedelic hip-hop. Those kind of broke the rules, but they're both real soulful. I really thought that Jaylib would do better. It did about half of what Madvillain did. I mean, Jay Dee's stuff is so good. Part of it was that we put it out in the wintertime, and you can't compete with the Britney Spears and Eminems of the world, so that had something to do with it. I think the cover didn't catch on either. We were trying to think of something that symbolized both L.A. and Detroit, but I don't think the tire track really resonated [laughs].

N*E*R*D was on BET talking about J Dilla and the interviewer and audience didn't know who he was. At that point I realized that my perspective and the Stones Throw audience perspective weren't always going to be the same thing.

SS: How influential is audience taste in deciding what you release on the label?

PBW: I think [the audience reaction] can really change things. Russell Simmons started Def Jam as a hip-hop label, but when he started putting out doo-wop records, and Rick Rubin started recording metal bands, the audience didn't like it. And Def Jam was in danger of going under, and they returned it to the hip-hop roots to keep it going.

There's stuff I'd like to work with. A friend of mine has a group called Baron Zen. It's like hip-hop death rock. I'd like to release it, but I don't the fans would like it. As much as I, personally, might like something, we're running a business. That's why we started the 7” series. So I could do more niche things that might not work on a larger scale.

SS: What are some things you'd like to see or do with the label in the future?

PBW: I'd like to see our audience expand. When Quasimoto came out, the joke was that our fans were young white males with DSL lines. Now it's young white males with cable lines [laughs]. When I go out and DJ, I see the fans, and unfortunately, it's a lot more male-based. It's a little frustrating to me. I don't understand exactly why that is. Maybe that whole collector type of thing just appeals to a certain demographic. I don't want to be known as a kitschy label, though, as something just for collectors. I think we got the music part down, now it's just a matter of getting it heard by different kinds of people.

I'd like to win a Grammy. I'd like one of ours to win a Grammy. I'd like to have gold plaques. I struggle with it, though, because half of me doesn't care at all, but...I want to see Madlib owning a house. I'd like to own a house. I want everyone to not have to worry about money and not have to worry about where their money's coming from. When we make money we put it back into the label. I DJ, I was in a Sprite commercial last year - that's how I make a living. So it'd be nice if the label on its own could everyone living comfortably.

Madlib, it seems like most of the time he doesn't care if he wins a Grammy. Like Chuck D. said: “Who gives a fuck about a Grammy.” Diamond D said he wouldn't win one, then he won one for the Fugees album. But I'd like Madlib to start working with some more of the bigger arena-type people, to see him working with Jay-Z. But to see Madlib collaborate with anyone, really, would be great.

I'd like to work with some artists that most people wouldn't think of for Stones Throw. Like Chow Nasty, this group that is kind of blues rock. I'd like to work with Sa-Ra, too, but they have so many commitments with other labels. Right now, we're working with Aloe Blacc, a real talented singer-producer-rapper.

SS: Who are the other artists and labels you feel aligned with?

PBW: A lot of the indie labels. Def Jux - we always get compared to them, even though we're so different in sound, but we have a lot of the same ideas. I think BBE and Stones Throw are a little closer in terms of artists. Pete Rock's another artist I have a lot of respect for. One of my favorite labels is Soul Jazz - they're doing so many different things, real big on the reggae. Ubiquity really stepped up their new artists. Platinum Pied Pipers, I'm personally into that stuff. Sa-Ra Creative Partners, I wanted to put out their records on Stones Throw.

SS: You said recently that you “resisted commercial rap for as long as possible, but now commercial rap is better than indie rap.” What do you see as the biggest differences between what you do at Stones Throw and what they do at Roc-A-Fella?

PBW: It's different scenes. Myself, I buy all the commercial stuff. I have a big respect for Roc-A-Fella. I'm pretty cool with Just Blaze. And Jay-Z is one of the kings. At the same time, we take a lot more risks but we don't have the same pressures as them. But the commercial stuff takes more risks than it used to. There was a while when people were sampling songs that were already a hit and making it worse. Hip-hop started in order to make people hear music they hadn't heard before.

SS: What's been the biggest single challenge/obstacle you've encountered since starting the label?

PBW: Accounting. Promotions. Knowing how much money to put into promotion, getting the artists' name out there, getting the artists to tour. Atmosphere, for instance, hits hard with the touring in the U.S., and I kind of wish some of our artists did that. It pays off. Groups like Jurassic Five, Atmosphere, Dilated Peoples - those groups got a lot more popular after touring.

SS: What's the best compliment you've received since starting the label?

PBW: Just that The Source won't review our records [laughs]. They reviewed the Lootpack album and gave it a poor mic review. I thought about using that in a promotional campaign: “Zero mics in The Source.” It's two different worlds. We can get 5 or 6 pages in [a rock magazine like] Spin easier than we can get a review in The Source.

We have a lot fans in Europe. Radiohead's complimented us. The guy from Lord of the Rings, Elijah Wood. I ran into him in an airport and he owned all the records. He was asking what it was like to know Madlib and Peanut Butter Wolf [laughs]. Someone like him, I wouldn't think he would even know about indie hip-hop, but he knew more than me. He was talking about David Axelrod, everything.

SS: As far as music goes, what are some records that people would be surprised to know Peanut Butter Wolf listens to?

PBW: House music, I guess. I buy a lot of house. It's a little more expected now, I guess. I like early '80s new wave, punk rock. Jay Dee just turned me on to the Bruce Haack Electric Lucifer, which I'm ashamed to say I'd never heard. Jay Dee also has an appreciation for a lot of '80s rock. I like Van Halen. Black Sabbath I turned my back on all growing up, and now I DJ it and people go nuts. Violent Femmes. Americana rock, stuff with shuffle drums. The Smiths. I DJ in Manchester and play the Smiths, half love it, half start booing. It's hard though, reading interviews with Morrissey, saying hip-hop's not music. It makes it hard to appreciate those people's music. Someone as legendary as Weldon Irvine, whose records are sampled all the time - he had such a respect for hip-hop, playing with Mos Def and everything. I can't understand when people make these sweeping put-downs; it's like a publicity stunt or something.

SS: What's your favorite traveling music?

PBW: Madlib makes CDs specifically for airplane trips. He's afraid of flying, and I'm afraid of flying, too. So I listen to a lot of his mixes: Brazilian stuff, really relaxing stuff, a lot of jazz. On a plane, I'll listen to Yesterday's New Quintet, or The Free Design.

SS: Where's your favorite place to listen to music?

PBW: The car. Or in a club, when I'm DJing and everyone's dancing. Plastic People in London, they have such a good sound system. I love hearing stuff there. I love hearing music loud, with the bass real loud. Where I hate listening to music is on a computer. It's frustrating how much people listen to music on their computers now. Music isn't meant to be listened to on 1/2 inch speakers. I wish I could outlaw that.
 
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