|GODZ PLAN|
- Thread starter |GOD|||ZILLA|
- Start date
of course, as it is said, God knows everything before it happens. He has control, but I believe that he shares that with us. That's where the free will comes in. We have choices. I don't believe God punishes the same way a court sentences a killer to the death penalty. I believe we reap what we sow, by law. We get what is in store for us by law. You can call this God's law, the law of cause and effect, or karmic law. I believe, as people, we tend to add the idea of a father-figure to God because it makes us feel closer to the absolute. When really he works by law. It isn't the outer God that condemns us, it is the inner God. It is God working through us that makes us condemned. Just as quick, it is the God within who forgives us. How can God forgive you if you can't even forgive yourself? It is just like in the bible when Jesus heals someone he makes no implication to the persons disability. He rids the man of any thought he had of it. He believes the cripple (for example) can walk. And it is done unto him as he believes. That, to me, is just a good idea of how its all within us to make these choices. Its all in mind. Its very much a paradox because....
yes, God has control of everything, but at the same time so do we on a relative level........
yes, God has control of everything, but at the same time so do we on a relative level........
Free will could also be called 'paths'. You can either walk a good path or a bad path. I feel there are evil forces and good forces. You can use those forces to your benifit. The paths are attempts to happiness. Evil is just an attempt at what is good. Yet evil always falls short. The choice is yours. Pull the trigger. God didn't tell you to pull the trigger. You are in control of your life. To an extent. Mabey God put the gun in your hand, it is up to you if you pull the trigger or not.
If your hand causes you to sin cut it off, if your eye causes you to sin poke it out, as Jesus says. Your mind is control of your body, your body doesnt control you.
You think therefore you are as the Bible says.
I just feel if I do evil in this life and ruin my hopes and dreams. Then when I die I will look back on my life and regret all the dumb choices I made. The would of , should of , could of's of my life. Kinda like the 'Christmas Carol' when the Spirit takes Scrooge back to his life and takes a look at his life. That is what I think some of hell is. The regret of all the mistakes made in life. All of the missed opportunites because of the sinful life. This is only my opinion.
Think about it. The only garuntee in life is death. What in your life did you choose? Your name? your parents? your house? Your race? What do you own that wasnt given to you?
Once you die what do you have to show for your life? If you had to look back on your life would you be proud of what you see? would you regret anything?
What happens when you die? do the lights just turn out? are you 100% sure? you better be.
You think therefore you are. As the Bible says.
If your hand causes you to sin cut it off, if your eye causes you to sin poke it out, as Jesus says. Your mind is control of your body, your body doesnt control you.
You think therefore you are as the Bible says.
I just feel if I do evil in this life and ruin my hopes and dreams. Then when I die I will look back on my life and regret all the dumb choices I made. The would of , should of , could of's of my life. Kinda like the 'Christmas Carol' when the Spirit takes Scrooge back to his life and takes a look at his life. That is what I think some of hell is. The regret of all the mistakes made in life. All of the missed opportunites because of the sinful life. This is only my opinion.
Think about it. The only garuntee in life is death. What in your life did you choose? Your name? your parents? your house? Your race? What do you own that wasnt given to you?
Once you die what do you have to show for your life? If you had to look back on your life would you be proud of what you see? would you regret anything?
What happens when you die? do the lights just turn out? are you 100% sure? you better be.
You think therefore you are. As the Bible says.
ok lets get 1 thing str8. god gave moses the ten commandments right?? he told him to spread the word. but god didnt give ME the commandments! so why should i listen? moses didnt tell me the 10 things either. so if god wants me to listen hes gonna have to do it himself! i am demanding god to come a visit me tonight in a dream or somethin. i need to talk to him personally. u know the saying, believe nothing u hear and half of what u see? well god u gotta talk to me twice!
If you kill the person, you just stooped down to his level. First, life, giving and taking, is only up to God, so by killing sumone your insulting him, takin his authority, stepping out of bounds, its not your life to take. So it will be a sin
Word homie, our subconcious mind, is a hidden tresure, it has the ability to heal, and manupalate our life/destiny the way we want it.["The Power Of Your Subconcious mind" by Joseph Murphy - cop this book]
So God has given us the power, to help oursevles
Anyway, forexample if an innocent kid dies due to sum natural cause, uhm say cancer or sumting. And hes just a kid, not sinned or anything. Its hard to understand why he had to die?
Now, to understand why he had to die, we would have to review the entire spiritual history of that person, which is beyond our abilities, so in that case, i guess it is part of "God's Divine Plan".
And many times things that bring us discomfert are misbeleived to be "Evil". Like if a child is stopped from eatin chocolates by his father, he beleives his father to be evil, but in reality, his father is working in the childs best interest...As the child grows up and matures, he understands how his fathers act helped him maintain good healthy teeth, and not become obese etc. So just like that we, many are in the "baby" stages, where God is our father, and we cant understand everything he does. And then a lot of things, are the result of our own actions, and many fail to recognize that and go blaming people, and God.
peace
-{bLaDe}
Word homie, our subconcious mind, is a hidden tresure, it has the ability to heal, and manupalate our life/destiny the way we want it.["The Power Of Your Subconcious mind" by Joseph Murphy - cop this book]
So God has given us the power, to help oursevles
Anyway, forexample if an innocent kid dies due to sum natural cause, uhm say cancer or sumting. And hes just a kid, not sinned or anything. Its hard to understand why he had to die?
Now, to understand why he had to die, we would have to review the entire spiritual history of that person, which is beyond our abilities, so in that case, i guess it is part of "God's Divine Plan".
And many times things that bring us discomfert are misbeleived to be "Evil". Like if a child is stopped from eatin chocolates by his father, he beleives his father to be evil, but in reality, his father is working in the childs best interest...As the child grows up and matures, he understands how his fathers act helped him maintain good healthy teeth, and not become obese etc. So just like that we, many are in the "baby" stages, where God is our father, and we cant understand everything he does. And then a lot of things, are the result of our own actions, and many fail to recognize that and go blaming people, and God.
peace
-{bLaDe}
Well first off, the reason we pray to God, is not for his pleasure, but for our benifit. So your not doing him like a favour by praying to him. And even if you beleive in religion or not, following basic principles of religion can make you a better person.
By researching religiious beleifs deeply, you'll find the answer to most of your questions tho. And it aint like your stuck to the religion your born in, you do have the liberty of checking out other religious belifs..
By the way, im flattered you quoted me and put it in your signature -haha, peace
-{bLaDe}
By researching religiious beleifs deeply, you'll find the answer to most of your questions tho. And it aint like your stuck to the religion your born in, you do have the liberty of checking out other religious belifs..
By the way, im flattered you quoted me and put it in your signature -haha, peace
-{bLaDe}
@n9ne
You stated that God knows everything before it happens and god has control of everything. In other words, god is the all knowing and all-powerful.
Now, if god "knows all" then god knows all of our fates, including "his" fate. But if he is "all powerful" then god has the power to change our fates and his own fate if he desired.
If god knows the future, then he could NOT be all-powerful. To be so is impossible. You cannot have both.
If god is all-powerful, can god create a square triangle?
Or how about a married bachelor?
Could god create something so heavy that even god couldn’t lift? But what if he wanted to?
There must be some limits even to god; therefore he could not be all-powerful.
If god truly is all knowing, then why should some humans be punished for what he created?
If god knows all, then he would have known I am Atheist before I was even created, it was god that made me an atheist. It was never my choice. Same goes for a serial killer, rapist, Jew, Muslim, etc.
You stated that God knows everything before it happens and god has control of everything. In other words, god is the all knowing and all-powerful.
Now, if god "knows all" then god knows all of our fates, including "his" fate. But if he is "all powerful" then god has the power to change our fates and his own fate if he desired.
If god knows the future, then he could NOT be all-powerful. To be so is impossible. You cannot have both.
If god is all-powerful, can god create a square triangle?
Or how about a married bachelor?
Could god create something so heavy that even god couldn’t lift? But what if he wanted to?
There must be some limits even to god; therefore he could not be all-powerful.
If god truly is all knowing, then why should some humans be punished for what he created?
If god knows all, then he would have known I am Atheist before I was even created, it was god that made me an atheist. It was never my choice. Same goes for a serial killer, rapist, Jew, Muslim, etc.
If god knows all, then he would have known I am Atheist before I was even created, it was god that made me an atheist. It was never my choice. Same goes for a serial killer, rapist, Jew, Muslim, etc.
excelent point. I think about this a lot. Did my beliefs choose me or did I choose my beliefs?
I also think mabey I chose my life I just don't know it. It's a strong posibility. Mabey someone chose my life I just have to live it to figure out why I live the way I live. Who am I. How did I get here. Where am I going. Its all one crazy question game.....I try to read older wiser points of view. People that have been putting it down way before I have. If you ask me life trips me out...
excelent point. I think about this a lot. Did my beliefs choose me or did I choose my beliefs?
I also think mabey I chose my life I just don't know it. It's a strong posibility. Mabey someone chose my life I just have to live it to figure out why I live the way I live. Who am I. How did I get here. Where am I going. Its all one crazy question game.....I try to read older wiser points of view. People that have been putting it down way before I have. If you ask me life trips me out...
quote:
Anyway, forexample if an innocent kid dies due to sum natural cause, uhm say cancer or sumting. And hes just a kid, not sinned or anything. Its hard to understand why he had to die?
Now, to understand why he had to die, we would have to review the entire spiritual history of that person, which is beyond our abilities, so in that case, i guess it is part of "God's Divine Plan".
And many times things that bring us discomfert are misbeleived to be "Evil". Like if a child is stopped from eatin chocolates by his father, he beleives his father to be evil, but in reality, his father is working in the childs best interest...As the child grows up and matures, he understands how his fathers act helped him maintain good healthy teeth, and not become obese etc. So just like that we, many are in the "baby" stages, where God is our father, and we cant understand everything he does. And then a lot of things, are the result of our own actions, and many fail to recognize that and go blaming people, and God
--blaDe
This is a very good point about "evil". You made an example of how evil can be defined as that which is "undesirable" to our wants. Which makes it a relative idea. There can truly be no room for evil in the absolute. We all agree that God is not evil. Evil is merely the limitation we must overcome to see a better good. Evil is the obstruction of good. Not truly opposing it. It is simply, our ignorance of the full reality. That is why it is our nature, I believe, to constantly try to be understanding of others and their ideas. To hold compassion for everything and everyone. Only this way shall we grow past these "evils". When we can let go of the idea of an isolated ego and our own petty selfishness (or selfish pettiness) we will rid our existence of much of these "evils". Most of us don't understand why God does certain things, this is true. That is why our nature, especially in the eyes of God, is to continually be open minded and understanding. If one is to understand that physical death isn't real, and one no longer holds so tightly onto these material things they will no longer fear death. In God's eyes what we perceive as death remains continous life. Physical death is just the beginning of new life.
Anyway, forexample if an innocent kid dies due to sum natural cause, uhm say cancer or sumting. And hes just a kid, not sinned or anything. Its hard to understand why he had to die?
Now, to understand why he had to die, we would have to review the entire spiritual history of that person, which is beyond our abilities, so in that case, i guess it is part of "God's Divine Plan".
And many times things that bring us discomfert are misbeleived to be "Evil". Like if a child is stopped from eatin chocolates by his father, he beleives his father to be evil, but in reality, his father is working in the childs best interest...As the child grows up and matures, he understands how his fathers act helped him maintain good healthy teeth, and not become obese etc. So just like that we, many are in the "baby" stages, where God is our father, and we cant understand everything he does. And then a lot of things, are the result of our own actions, and many fail to recognize that and go blaming people, and God
--blaDe
This is a very good point about "evil". You made an example of how evil can be defined as that which is "undesirable" to our wants. Which makes it a relative idea. There can truly be no room for evil in the absolute. We all agree that God is not evil. Evil is merely the limitation we must overcome to see a better good. Evil is the obstruction of good. Not truly opposing it. It is simply, our ignorance of the full reality. That is why it is our nature, I believe, to constantly try to be understanding of others and their ideas. To hold compassion for everything and everyone. Only this way shall we grow past these "evils". When we can let go of the idea of an isolated ego and our own petty selfishness (or selfish pettiness) we will rid our existence of much of these "evils". Most of us don't understand why God does certain things, this is true. That is why our nature, especially in the eyes of God, is to continually be open minded and understanding. If one is to understand that physical death isn't real, and one no longer holds so tightly onto these material things they will no longer fear death. In God's eyes what we perceive as death remains continous life. Physical death is just the beginning of new life.
@2-0-Sixx
quote:
Now, if god "knows all" then god knows all of our fates, including "his" fate. But if he is "all powerful" then god has the power to change our fates and his own fate if he desired.
good point, but you're missing a lot of numbers to this equation. First of all, God does not have a fate. God is the immovable, static reality who is all places at once. God does not need to travel, he is there! He does not change his nature. He is everything. His nature is everything. There is no change in God. He is all now, before, and from now on. This is as much as we can understand about God. Second, Yes God has the power to change our fates. What you fail to realize is that we are subjects under God's law. This concept of God's law is a very good one and it reconciles these problems you are having with "choice versus grand design". I suggest you pick up a book entitled, "The Science of Mind". It is very similar to Christian Science, but it goes deeper. The idea is that God's "law" is eternal with God, and yet, is a part of God also. This law does not have firm grasp at everything the universe does, obviously. It sets everything in motion. By God's law, God shares with us the power to make choices by loosening his grasp on how things play out. God knows that which will happen because God is beyond the limitations of time. God is already present at all times. He is eternal. Therefore you are attempting to affiliate a finite concept of time unto an infinite being of eternity.
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If god knows the future, then he could NOT be all-powerful. To be so is impossible. You cannot have both.
To add to what I wrote above........
God knows the future AND is all-powerful. This doesn't mean that he flexes his power to the fullest. He has no need to. He sets everything in motion. He puts the pieces on the game board. We roll the dice. And by His law we get our results. Not only is he "all-powerful". He has the power to share his power with us. He gives us freedom in our finite existence to choose "paths", as BaSICCally stated. If God flexed absolute power upon us there would be no reason for this discussion. We would have no choices and God would move us around like mechanical pieces. We would not have a soul. We would not share a part in the divine mind. We would have no conciousness of our own being as we do. If it is easier to reconcile this in your mind, my friend, think of it this way.......
remember what I always would state: By merely discussing God we are seperating him, in mind, from his "creation". God is as much external as he is internal. The only way we perceive anything is through our own minds. So, to look for this "external" God is a lost cause. Once, in our minds, we unite God with the rest of existence we see that it is no longer the idea of an external force putting his control upon the world. The world is another part of God. It is obvious that there are parts of God who are not fully conscious of their own being (all of us humans). We are a part of God which are made in the nature of self-discovery. We grow as a part of God eternally into the entirety of God.
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If god is all-powerful, can god create a square triangle?
Sure. But the question is, can you conceive of one?
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quote:
Or how about a married bachelor?
sure. These are all opinions. they are concepts we created. God is not limited by them. So, why attempt to ask God to create something which contradicts itself in our eyes. We will not understand it.
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Could god create something so heavy that even god couldn’t lift? But what if he wanted to?
This is a classic atheist phrase. God is not bound by your thoughts of physical properties. He cannot create things which he cannot lift. He is beyond the physical world. But, knowing that we are all a part of God's whole; We are all a part of God, you must specify which part you are asking could pick it up. I can create something I cannot pick up by myself. But, I alone am not God, merely a part. If you mean for the entirety of God (all existence) to create something in which the entirety of God cannot lift then you might as well ask infinity to pick itself up. (LOL) Its also like asking the infinite to create another infinity. YOU CAN NOT ADD TO INFINITY! there is no infinity plus one. This does not compromise God's power because God is already infinity. There are no boundaries. So to imply God to not be all-powerful because he cannot create another infinity is ridiculous thought. There is only one infinity! Don't let your finite mind delude you. By implying that God should have the power to create another infinity you are underestimating what infinity really is, INFINITE! We can not perceive of infinity in its entirety because we are not its entirety. So, the only thing you can be worried about is your own growth into this infinity. God will forever hold paradoxes in our finite minds. I will end this paragraph with one single phrase: God can not go against his own nature.
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quote:
There must be some limits even to god; therefore he could not be all-powerful.
no limits to God. Just limits in your perceiving God. Do not be confused when you attempt to ascribe finite concepts to the infinite. You set yourself up for that.
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quote:
If god truly is all knowing, then why should some humans be punished for what he created?
By law. I already explained the nature of God's law above. He has this law, you can call it the law of cause and effect, if you wish. The Law, where he does not hold firm grasp in our growth, but lets us make choices and reap what we sow under this law. GOD SHARES POWER.
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quote:
If god knows all, then he would have known I am Atheist before I was even created, it was god that made me an atheist. It was never my choice. Same goes for a serial killer, rapist, Jew, Muslim, etc.
God gave you the choice to become an atheist under his law. Once again, God shares power. If God could make everyone one religion then we would be mere mechanical forces of nature without "nous". ("nous" is Greek for "reasoning mind" especially "divine reasoning").
quote:
Now, if god "knows all" then god knows all of our fates, including "his" fate. But if he is "all powerful" then god has the power to change our fates and his own fate if he desired.
good point, but you're missing a lot of numbers to this equation. First of all, God does not have a fate. God is the immovable, static reality who is all places at once. God does not need to travel, he is there! He does not change his nature. He is everything. His nature is everything. There is no change in God. He is all now, before, and from now on. This is as much as we can understand about God. Second, Yes God has the power to change our fates. What you fail to realize is that we are subjects under God's law. This concept of God's law is a very good one and it reconciles these problems you are having with "choice versus grand design". I suggest you pick up a book entitled, "The Science of Mind". It is very similar to Christian Science, but it goes deeper. The idea is that God's "law" is eternal with God, and yet, is a part of God also. This law does not have firm grasp at everything the universe does, obviously. It sets everything in motion. By God's law, God shares with us the power to make choices by loosening his grasp on how things play out. God knows that which will happen because God is beyond the limitations of time. God is already present at all times. He is eternal. Therefore you are attempting to affiliate a finite concept of time unto an infinite being of eternity.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
If god knows the future, then he could NOT be all-powerful. To be so is impossible. You cannot have both.
To add to what I wrote above........
God knows the future AND is all-powerful. This doesn't mean that he flexes his power to the fullest. He has no need to. He sets everything in motion. He puts the pieces on the game board. We roll the dice. And by His law we get our results. Not only is he "all-powerful". He has the power to share his power with us. He gives us freedom in our finite existence to choose "paths", as BaSICCally stated. If God flexed absolute power upon us there would be no reason for this discussion. We would have no choices and God would move us around like mechanical pieces. We would not have a soul. We would not share a part in the divine mind. We would have no conciousness of our own being as we do. If it is easier to reconcile this in your mind, my friend, think of it this way.......
remember what I always would state: By merely discussing God we are seperating him, in mind, from his "creation". God is as much external as he is internal. The only way we perceive anything is through our own minds. So, to look for this "external" God is a lost cause. Once, in our minds, we unite God with the rest of existence we see that it is no longer the idea of an external force putting his control upon the world. The world is another part of God. It is obvious that there are parts of God who are not fully conscious of their own being (all of us humans). We are a part of God which are made in the nature of self-discovery. We grow as a part of God eternally into the entirety of God.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
If god is all-powerful, can god create a square triangle?
Sure. But the question is, can you conceive of one?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
Or how about a married bachelor?
sure. These are all opinions. they are concepts we created. God is not limited by them. So, why attempt to ask God to create something which contradicts itself in our eyes. We will not understand it.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
Could god create something so heavy that even god couldn’t lift? But what if he wanted to?
This is a classic atheist phrase. God is not bound by your thoughts of physical properties. He cannot create things which he cannot lift. He is beyond the physical world. But, knowing that we are all a part of God's whole; We are all a part of God, you must specify which part you are asking could pick it up. I can create something I cannot pick up by myself. But, I alone am not God, merely a part. If you mean for the entirety of God (all existence) to create something in which the entirety of God cannot lift then you might as well ask infinity to pick itself up. (LOL) Its also like asking the infinite to create another infinity. YOU CAN NOT ADD TO INFINITY! there is no infinity plus one. This does not compromise God's power because God is already infinity. There are no boundaries. So to imply God to not be all-powerful because he cannot create another infinity is ridiculous thought. There is only one infinity! Don't let your finite mind delude you. By implying that God should have the power to create another infinity you are underestimating what infinity really is, INFINITE! We can not perceive of infinity in its entirety because we are not its entirety. So, the only thing you can be worried about is your own growth into this infinity. God will forever hold paradoxes in our finite minds. I will end this paragraph with one single phrase: God can not go against his own nature.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
There must be some limits even to god; therefore he could not be all-powerful.
no limits to God. Just limits in your perceiving God. Do not be confused when you attempt to ascribe finite concepts to the infinite. You set yourself up for that.
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quote:
If god truly is all knowing, then why should some humans be punished for what he created?
By law. I already explained the nature of God's law above. He has this law, you can call it the law of cause and effect, if you wish. The Law, where he does not hold firm grasp in our growth, but lets us make choices and reap what we sow under this law. GOD SHARES POWER.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
If god knows all, then he would have known I am Atheist before I was even created, it was god that made me an atheist. It was never my choice. Same goes for a serial killer, rapist, Jew, Muslim, etc.
God gave you the choice to become an atheist under his law. Once again, God shares power. If God could make everyone one religion then we would be mere mechanical forces of nature without "nous". ("nous" is Greek for "reasoning mind" especially "divine reasoning").
God knows what im gunna do before it happens? bullshit i believe that there is a God but uno what..fuck that shit...at any second i could put a gun to my head and blow my life away...and so could anyone else for that matter....ok and lets say for a minute he does...most of the people that bellieve in "our" God live in the U.S. well the last time i checked our country wasnt exactly going anywhere fast....just my 2cents