International Shipping????

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Apr 25, 2002
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#1
I want your opinions on international shipping.
Buyers can rip you off way too easy using paypal.
Whats the cheapest way to get a tracking number for international orders? I know USPS has Express mail but it's hella expensive. I was thinking of making that mandatory & charging for it but that would greatly affect the amount of international bids I get.
Any ideas?
 
Jan 6, 2003
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#3
Buyers can rip you off way too easy using paypal.
I totally understand your problem and frustration but I have to admit that it pisses me off that many sellers treat me like I'm a scammer until proven innocent, only because I live outside USA. I buy something like 200 CDs a year and I receive 99% of all packages that I order. If I have a problem I contact the seller to try to solve it to the best for both parts. I'm 33 years old and I don't want to rip somebody off for a CD price but some sellers make me feel like every email about a lost package is a scam attempt. To be honest, nowadays when I see sellers forcing me to pay additional $10-15 for registered mail the CD has to be something very special for me to consider placing a bid. Yes, I understand that there are hella scammers benefiting from the paypal claim option, but in the end, the honest buyers pay the price too in increased fees, shipping and registered shipping and the fact that sellers treat every buyer as a scammer.
 
Nov 2, 2007
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#4
I think it's very rare that a package gets lost on its way... I live in Finland and only once I didn't receive the shit I bought. That was from France and the seller couldn't even prove that he really sent em cds. So in my opinion there's no need to force ppl to pay for the registered mail. I've sold few items too and when they went for near 200$ I just upgraded the shipping method to registered free of charge. I didn't wanna risk anything. The buyer probably would have been happy without that registered mail too. It should be buyers choice..
 
Dec 6, 2002
3,124
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www.BayUndaground.com
#5
I totally understand your problem and frustration but I have to admit that it pisses me off that many sellers treat me like I'm a scammer until proven innocent, only because I live outside USA. I buy something like 200 CDs a year and I receive 99% of all packages that I order. If I have a problem I contact the seller to try to solve it to the best for both parts. I'm 33 years old and I don't want to rip somebody off for a CD price but some sellers make me feel like every email about a lost package is a scam attempt. To be honest, nowadays when I see sellers forcing me to pay additional $10-15 for registered mail the CD has to be something very special for me to consider placing a bid. Yes, I understand that there are hella scammers benefiting from the paypal claim option, but in the end, the honest buyers pay the price too in increased fees, shipping and registered shipping and the fact that sellers treat every buyer as a scammer.
I agree homie. Just take into consideration that there are legit buyers out there with 99% and up positive feedback and don't make them pay that additional $11 haha.
 
Apr 25, 2002
420
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#6
Thanks for your feedback guys.
Im thinking that I might make it mandatory on items $50 & up.
I agree that 99% of international orders are fine but that 1% adds up when you're selling a lot of items, some very valuable at that. I keep all my postal receipts but paypal doesnt think that's enough. Assholes.
 
Jan 6, 2003
1,662
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#7
Im thinking that I might make it mandatory on items $50 & up.
Yeah, that might be a good way to solve the problem. But one question, just out of my ignorance, it's always about scammers from outside USA. What about US scammers? Are those easier to reveal or is there any US tracking system that works? I'm just curious because considering most ebayers are Americans I find it quite strange that most supposed scammers are from Europe...
 
Mar 14, 2006
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#10
^^ I don't know, but i feel my european legit collectors...

I'm from FRANCE, I have dealt with many of peeps right there on siccness, & did hundred of transactions on ebay...i bought big value CDs & got them with any problem with standart shipping...
Besides, i can understand that as a seller, U have to protect yourself...

Don't forget to put me on that list if it's gonna be updated. :)
 
Jul 7, 2005
2,332
69
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www.mintunderground.com
#11
It's not a Conspiracy!

Shipping and tracking costs are way different if shipping in the US vs. shipping outside the US. When your shipping inside the US using pay pal's shipping methods or just regular USPS mail, the cost of tracking in the US is .18 cents if using Pay Pal. It's about .50 cents if you go directly to the post office and using their florescent green tracking label. Both of these can be tracked via the web/internet. The cost for overseas is a whole lot more ($11 for Registered and about $20 or more depending on what country you are sending to and the weight of the package for Express Mail). That's just the tracking portion. We also have to buy materials, gas and other unseen and forgone costs. That's another subject though.

To answer the question as to why it seems that most American sellers say that they have problem outside of the US, is because it's true. It may not be "you" specifically, but it's true. In all of my years of selling, I have not had one, I repeat one US customer file a compliant for lost or stolen package and if they did it was quickly handled, because I always send all US packages with tracking via Pay Pal shipping methods (They already have the information on file).

It has been very easy for Overseas/Worldwide Customers to file a claim for lost or stolen/Non receipt items, whether it be true or not. The Overseas/Worldwide buyer can simply file a claim based upon the fact that Pay Pal's policy towards all addresses outside of the US. Pay Pal's policy is that all addresses outside the US are "Unverified". What this means is that they can't verify anything on overseas accounts. This also means that sellers must ship at their own risk. Now we American sellers have had to find ways to avoid this problem of theft. I'll be honest with you...I have lost at least 3K in theft/lost or stolen claims against me. You're darn right that I'm going to find a way to protect myself, because the lord know that I sent all of these packages. I don't know what happened to these packages once they left my hand, but I do know this...I shipped them. All that I know is that I had no way of proving this to Pay Pal. Not anymore. I apply my " REQUIRED Registered Mail" rule to all shipments that "Total" $30 or more. I do this regardless of how many transactions we may have had in the past or whatever. I just don't want to take a chance anymore. Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Due to these claim's whether they are fictitious or not, we American sellers only have a few choices of proving of protecting ourselves "AND" our clients/customers. We only have a few choices of proving and providing evidence of the receipt of a package. Remember this proof has to be via the viewing/tracking by the web/internet. The only choices that are available for an American seller are: Registered Mail (USPS), Express mail (USPS), UPS, Fed Ex & DHL. All of those options cost a lot more and we have to pass along those costs to the buyer because it isn't free.

Is this fair to all clients overseas? Absolutely Not! Do the few thieves who prey on unsuspecting sellers represent all of the Euro/Asian customer base? Absolutely not and I will never say that.

Now, on the other hand... Is it fair to the sellers to have to take this risk? Absolutely not.

Believe me...I don't like to do this and I can't stand the fact that I and anybody else have to deal with this nonsense. Nobody likes to charge extra fee's, just so we could ourselves. Let's face it, we do this due to our online shopping and selling experiences.

Once again, American buyers items are shipped with tracking too, but it cost a whole lot less; therefore a seller can usually include that cost within his shipping fees. The bottom line is...Pay Pal will not protect a seller if he ships to anybody outside of the US, unless you ship with a form of tracking and this tracking "MUST" be able to be viewed on the web/internet.

Don't take it personal people. It's just the way that it is and yes, it's fucked up, but what can we do about it? Nothing. Pay Pal isn't going to protect the seller or the buyer. We can't get rid the world of thieves, so I do what I gotta do. Believe me...America has it's share of fucked up thieves too, but it's easier to track our packages (Because only one company is needed in the US vs. 5 to 6 companies who handle the packages overseas) and it costs a lot less. Besides that... it's easier to show up at a mothafuckas crib, the next time that you are in that muthafuckas town. Ya dig?

Yes, you can get all of your packages overseas/worldwide by standard shipping. I know this to be true, because I did it for a long, long time. The only problem is that there are a lot "Legit Collectors" who are also "Legit Thieves" and now that "Legit Collector" got his collection off of ripping people off! Then their are the postage people and crooked governments who steal too. Ask my boy Westbanklover bka Ciopsta. I can't send shit to Italy without tracking. Them muthafuckas will jack you quick out there. Ciopsta/Westbanklover doesn't complain, he wants it because that's the only guaranteed way that he'll get his package. I know that these lost/stolen packages aren't his fault, but somebody at his post office and/or government agency is a thief. I'm not taking chances. Besides some of you cats are my friend one week and the next week you're talking bad about what you think you know about me. People are fickle and you don't know which way a person is feeling from day to day. I just don't take chances anymore. It's not personal, I just have to do what I gotta do. Oh yeah, that 3K is on the lower end of what I'm figuring in loses due to this type of behavior. You would get tired of getting jacked too. Put yourself in my shoes. I'm not that asshole who you may think that I am. I'm just a everyday person like you and I have the right to protect myself from this B.S. Don't blame the seller. Blame the Muthafuckas who fucked it up for you. Oh yeah, it costs to protect yourself and your customers. I'm not saying that the buyer really didn't get his package, but what I am saying is that I'm not only going to protect myself from now on, but also my customer. Like I said postal workers steal too.

Who would you rather buy from a guy who will answer your email questions, provide you with tracking even though it cost you more or the guy who only answers your questions until you pay his ass and once you've paid him, you cant get shit from him. Not even a email that says "Hello". Most of my CD's sell for more than $30. I don't know about you, but that's a lot of money to loose. I would feel better knowing that my sellers own self preservation practices can also save me from being fucked out of my hard earned money (If I were the buyer). I don't know why anybody would complain about safe means of shipping, especially If I bought/bid on the item and I knowing that this rule existed before hand. I mean people who have Required Shipping fees do post it in their listings. At least I do.

Man, you guys can't really be that simple-minded and think that people/sellers create these fee's for fun of it or as a means for a petty easy come up. An extra $11 is hardly worth it. Like I said, I wish that I didn't have to charge those fees for Registered Mail. Believe me I can't stand it either, but I am going to protect myself.

Oh yeah, quit thinking that Americans are greedy and that we're only out to get you and other, because you live overseas. Don't be so foolish. It's not a USA vs. Everybody else thing. Can a seller just want to protect him/herself?

It's not a conspiracy. If you believe that we American and/or Sellers are out to get you... then you need a hug, because you apparently have some self-esteem issues.




Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know....I wrote fucking book. I'm just tired of hearing all of this B.S. about why this, why that, How come sellers do this, How come sellers do that, why do Americans do this or that. Just take a moment with yourself and think about it. What you would do? What would you do if you were in the other persons shoes? What would you do if you kept getting people who claimed that they never got their package even though you did ship it. Have you ever considered that? Like I said, it's not a damn conspiracy.

Nothing is for free, not even protection! Remember that.
 
May 1, 2002
3,609
316
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#13
Shipping and tracking costs are way different if shipping in the US vs. shipping outside the US. When your shipping inside the US using pay pal's shipping methods or just regular USPS mail, the cost of tracking in the US is .18 cents if using Pay Pal. It's about .50 cents if you go directly to the post office and using their florescent green tracking label. Both of these can be tracked via the web/internet. The cost for overseas is a whole lot more ($11 for Registered and about $20 or more depending on what country you are sending to and the weight of the package for Express Mail). That's just the tracking portion. We also have to buy materials, gas and other unseen and forgone costs. That's another subject though.

To answer the question as to why it seems that most American sellers say that they have problem outside of the US, is because it's true. It may not be "you" specifically, but it's true. In all of my years of selling, I have not had one, I repeat one US customer file a compliant for lost or stolen package and if they did it was quickly handled, because I always send all US packages with tracking via Pay Pal shipping methods (They already have the information on file).

It has been very easy for Overseas/Worldwide Customers to file a claim for lost or stolen/Non receipt items, whether it be true or not. The Overseas/Worldwide buyer can simply file a claim based upon the fact that Pay Pal's policy towards all addresses outside of the US. Pay Pal's policy is that all addresses outside the US are "Unverified". What this means is that they can't verify anything on overseas accounts. This also means that sellers must ship at their own risk. Now we American sellers have had to find ways to avoid this problem of theft. I'll be honest with you...I have lost at least 3K in theft/lost or stolen claims against me. You're darn right that I'm going to find a way to protect myself, because the lord know that I sent all of these packages. I don't know what happened to these packages once they left my hand, but I do know this...I shipped them. All that I know is that I had no way of proving this to Pay Pal. Not anymore. I apply my " REQUIRED Registered Mail" rule to all shipments that "Total" $30 or more. I do this regardless of how many transactions we may have had in the past or whatever. I just don't want to take a chance anymore. Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Due to these claim's whether they are fictitious or not, we American sellers only have a few choices of proving of protecting ourselves "AND" our clients/customers. We only have a few choices of proving and providing evidence of the receipt of a package. Remember this proof has to be via the viewing/tracking by the web/internet. The only choices that are available for an American seller are: Registered Mail (USPS), Express mail (USPS), UPS, Fed Ex & DHL. All of those options cost a lot more and we have to pass along those costs to the buyer because it isn't free.

Is this fair to all clients overseas? Absolutely Not! Do the few thieves who prey on unsuspecting sellers represent all of the Euro/Asian customer base? Absolutely not and I will never say that.

Now, on the other hand... Is it fair to the sellers to have to take this risk? Absolutely not.

Believe me...I don't like to do this and I can't stand the fact that I and anybody else have to deal with this nonsense. Nobody likes to charge extra fee's, just so we could ourselves. Let's face it, we do this due to our online shopping and selling experiences.

Once again, American buyers items are shipped with tracking too, but it cost a whole lot less; therefore a seller can usually include that cost within his shipping fees. The bottom line is...Pay Pal will not protect a seller if he ships to anybody outside of the US, unless you ship with a form of tracking and this tracking "MUST" be able to be viewed on the web/internet.

Don't take it personal people. It's just the way that it is and yes, it's fucked up, but what can we do about it? Nothing. Pay Pal isn't going to protect the seller or the buyer. We can't get rid the world of thieves, so I do what I gotta do. Believe me...America has it's share of fucked up thieves too, but it's easier to track our packages (Because only one company is needed in the US vs. 5 to 6 companies who handle the packages overseas) and it costs a lot less. Besides that... it's easier to show up at a mothafuckas crib, the next time that you are in that muthafuckas town. Ya dig?

Yes, you can get all of your packages overseas/worldwide by standard shipping. I know this to be true, because I did it for a long, long time. The only problem is that there are a lot "Legit Collectors" who are also "Legit Thieves" and now that "Legit Collector" got his collection off of ripping people off! Then their are the postage people and crooked governments who steal too. Ask my boy Westbanklover bka Ciopsta. I can't send shit to Italy without tracking. Them muthafuckas will jack you quick out there. Ciopsta/Westbanklover doesn't complain, he wants it because that's the only guaranteed way that he'll get his package. I know that these lost/stolen packages aren't his fault, but somebody at his post office and/or government agency is a thief. I'm not taking chances. Besides some of you cats are my friend one week and the next week you're talking bad about what you think you know about me. People are fickle and you don't know which way a person is feeling from day to day. I just don't take chances anymore. It's not personal, I just have to do what I gotta do. Oh yeah, that 3K is on the lower end of what I'm figuring in loses due to this type of behavior. You would get tired of getting jacked too. Put yourself in my shoes. I'm not that asshole who you may think that I am. I'm just a everyday person like you and I have the right to protect myself from this B.S. Don't blame the seller. Blame the Muthafuckas who fucked it up for you. Oh yeah, it costs to protect yourself and your customers. I'm not saying that the buyer really didn't get his package, but what I am saying is that I'm not only going to protect myself from now on, but also my customer. Like I said postal workers steal too.

Who would you rather buy from a guy who will answer your email questions, provide you with tracking even though it cost you more or the guy who only answers your questions until you pay his ass and once you've paid him, you cant get shit from him. Not even a email that says "Hello". Most of my CD's sell for more than $30. I don't know about you, but that's a lot of money to loose. I would feel better knowing that my sellers own self preservation practices can also save me from being fucked out of my hard earned money (If I were the buyer). I don't know why anybody would complain about safe means of shipping, especially If I bought/bid on the item and I knowing that this rule existed before hand. I mean people who have Required Shipping fees do post it in their listings. At least I do.

Man, you guys can't really be that simple-minded and think that people/sellers create these fee's for fun of it or as a means for a petty easy come up. An extra $11 is hardly worth it. Like I said, I wish that I didn't have to charge those fees for Registered Mail. Believe me I can't stand it either, but I am going to protect myself.

Oh yeah, quit thinking that Americans are greedy and that we're only out to get you and other, because you live overseas. Don't be so foolish. It's not a USA vs. Everybody else thing. Can a seller just want to protect him/herself?

It's not a conspiracy. If you believe that we American and/or Sellers are out to get you... then you need a hug, because you apparently have some self-esteem issues.




Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know....I wrote fucking book. I'm just tired of hearing all of this B.S. about why this, why that, How come sellers do this, How come sellers do that, why do Americans do this or that. Just take a moment with yourself and think about it. What you would do? What would you do if you were in the other persons shoes? What would you do if you kept getting people who claimed that they never got their package even though you did ship it. Have you ever considered that? Like I said, it's not a damn conspiracy.

Nothing is for free, not even protection! Remember that.
co-sign
 
May 2, 2002
2,245
65
48
43
#15
question
just wondering what other sellers are doing
what point do you cut the additional registered mail fee for overseas purchases
say you have a guy in europe wins 6 cd's from you for $90, with the shipping fees I charge, that is $24 for shipping plus an additional $14 for registered.
do you guys that add the additional fee still add it.
i have been adding the fee and have ran into some complaints
but like sincere mentioned it takes a lot of damn work to get these packages ready to even be sent registered, boxes and that stupid ass paper tape.
plus i don't know what crazy price the dude at the post office is gonna give me when he weighs 6 cds to be sent registered.

anyways, does anyone have any insight?
 
Jul 7, 2005
2,332
69
0
www.mintunderground.com
#16
Yeah, that might be a good way to solve the problem. But one question, just out of my ignorance, it's always about scammers from outside USA. What about US scammers? Are those easier to reveal or is there any US tracking system that works? I'm just curious because considering most ebayers are Americans I find it quite strange that most supposed scammers are from Europe...
There's a system that works in the U.S. Once a package leaves the U.S. the shipping system fails, because it take more than one shipping companies/systems to get our packages to customers outside of the U.S.. These many shipping services system's do not communicate with the U.S. shipping system. That's were the failure begins. We don't have these problems with U.S. buyers, because it's one system and one company being used.

I've never, ever had a U.S. customer try to scam me with the, "I haven't received my package" scam. It doesn't work here in the U.S. as long as you ship with a shipping confirmation. Now if you don't ship with a shipping confirmation in the U.S., then you can get fucked, but I use Pay Pal's services, so shipping confirmation is automatic.
 
Jul 7, 2005
2,332
69
0
www.mintunderground.com
#17
I don't...

question
just wondering what other sellers are doing
what point do you cut the additional registered mail fee for overseas purchases
say you have a guy in europe wins 6 cd's from you for $90, with the shipping fees I charge, that is $24 for shipping plus an additional $14 for registered.
do you guys that add the additional fee still add it.
i have been adding the fee and have ran into some complaints
but like sincere mentioned it takes a lot of damn work to get these packages ready to even be sent registered, boxes and that stupid ass paper tape.
plus i don't know what crazy price the dude at the post office is gonna give me when he weighs 6 cds to be sent registered.

anyways, does anyone have any insight?
I don't ever stop charging for Registered Mail, regardless of how many CD's are sold. I don't do that, because I still have to pay to list the CD, Final Value Fee/FVF (once the CD sells), Pay Pal (pay Pay Pal to receive the payment), Gas, Materials and time. I have to pay my son who's about to be 16 years old to pull and process the packages. There are too many unseen/forgone expenses that the buyers don't see. I've ran into people who don't like these fee's as well, but once I kindly explain the process to them, most of them understand.

A lot of customers don't understand that the more you make the more eBay takes. If you sold a CD for $100 on eBay, they take $20+ of that sell in Final Value Fee's and insertion fees. Then the seller pay's eBay again in order to receive that $100 purchase, because Pay Pal is eBay's company too. Once it's all said and done, the seller only receives about $75 of that $100 sell. Then we have to pay for materials, gas, shipping and all of those other forgone costs (stated above), so the seller can complete the transaction.

It's not rocket science. The only person who's out of anything at the end of the day is the seller. eBay is the Devil! Lol! but really; they are a fucked up company!