Laying down drums/kits properly

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lunitunez

lunitunez

Sicc OG
#1
Apr 25, 2002
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#1
hey so I was just wondering how everyone handles their drums, what i do is keep my synth bass on one midi track, kick and snare on another, and then hi-hats etc all on seperate midi tracks, I used to grid quantize my drums at 80% usually @ 1/16 or 1/8 so they dont sound robotic, but now ill record my drums @ 100% grid quantize, and then maybe do like 20%-40% shuffle quantize on the kick and snare. I dont know if doing the 100% grid, and then 20%-40% shuffle is a waste of time or not, my thinking is get the drums perfectly lined up, and then shuffle them, but I dont know if shuffle already does that.

Also what works well for me is layering, maybe like a clap and snare, or a kick and hi-hat etc. to make the sound fuller. Same goes for when Im doing like a brass section, to make it sound fuller ill do like a high pitch brass, and then ill move down an octave or two, and play the exact same notes to make it sound fuller. like its a whole band section. What does everyone else do I need to learn new methods? Im using a fantom g6, and a mv-8800. ive stuck with Roland, my first machine was a mc-505 groovebox
 
V

Vince V.

Sicc OG
#3
Mar 22, 2004
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#3
maybe when you do brass or string sections try and play chords instead of the same note in lower octaves. You can google for chords and chord progressions if you need help with that.
 
Sydal

Sydal

Sicc OG
#5
Apr 25, 2002
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www.idealsentertainment.com
#5
I lay everything out on different tracks so I can compress and EQ everything individually. I also layer shit if it sounds too thin...but if something sounds decent but isn't quite as thick as I want it, I slap a Fat EQ on it and it fills the shit out nicely. Stereo spread also works well if you know how to use it. Quantizing to give the beat a certain swing is also a good idea...'cause the robotic sound gets old quickly. I have an MPC groove template in Logic Pro, so every now and then I use the MPC quantize to give the beat a nice swing.

About moving down an octave on brass sections and what not, it depends on the sound you are going for. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I agree with Vince in that you should try some chords. Doing so will fill beats out nicely and it's not always the same shit.

These days, many "producers" have little or no musical talent...they slap shit together that is simple and repetitive. So, in my opinion, doing the opposite will make you stand out. And remember, when you make a beat, know which direction you want the song to go. That way, when you give the beat to an artist, you can point them in the right direction, and you won't just be a "beat maker".
 
lunitunez

lunitunez

Sicc OG
#6
Apr 25, 2002
1,236
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#6
Sydal thanks for the input, ya i definitely want to stay away from repetitive songs, ive been reading up a bit on song structure and transitions. How does Stereo Spread work? Is that like Auto Pan? For example I'll put auto pan on my brass section to help make the whole song sound fuller, for this laid back track I did, I think I put the auto pan at like 1/4 or 1/2s and the depth range is 1-127 I believe so i put it around 90 to use more of the stereo spectrum for it to go back and forth, instead of it being limited to the middle or where ever it was originally panned to.
 
Sydal

Sydal

Sicc OG
#7
Apr 25, 2002
7,232
170
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www.idealsentertainment.com
#7
Kind of like a pan, but not really. It's the same idea as far as splitting to each monitor, but it doesn't really fade the sound out of either side. It's basically a way to make something sound wider or tighter. It can keep your sound in the middle, or knock it out to sound like it's coming more from the left and right. Kind of hard for me to explain without showing you on a screen.

Here's what it looks like. Don't need to pay attention to the guy 'cause his tutorials are a fuckin' joke, and 9 times out of 10 he doesn't know how to explain anything. This is just for a visual representation.

 
M

meltamic

Sicc OG
#8
Oct 20, 2008
547
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#8
+1 on layering and actually playing chords, putting a little reverb and a fat eq works well to. But don't put to much reverb on things or the end product sounds muddy if you know what I mean. Another thing to do is duplicate the same piece 3 time and pan one far left, the other far right, and leave one in the middle then adjust volumes accordingly.

The sperate and pan thing works well for strings, horns, vocals, etc.
 
V

Vince V.

Sicc OG
#9
Mar 22, 2004
972
0
0
#9
meltamic said:
+1 on layering and actually playing chords, putting a little reverb and a fat eq works well to. But don't put to much reverb on things or the end product sounds muddy if you know what I mean. Another thing to do is duplicate the same piece 3 time and pan one far left, the other far right, and leave one in the middle then adjust volumes accordingly.

The sperate and pan thing works well for strings, horns, vocals, etc.
Click to expand...
Some Good tips on using Reverb in the mix here
http://soundmob.com/20-tips-on-using-effects-in-the-mix/
 
BOOBOO619

BOOBOO619

Sicc OG
#11
Apr 26, 2006
4,496
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#11
As far as the composition of the drum beat goes, I suppose that's just up to you and what type of vibe you want for your beat. It could mean quantizing, no quantizing, swing, whatever you think sounds best.


But as far as "sonically" processing my drums, I do like to lay all the sounds out on different tracks and process each individually if needed. EQ, compression, or FX like reverb, delay..

Compressing the drums as a whole is a good idea as well to fatten it up, give it some pumping style character expression or just to glue everything up nicely. (I like Stillwell "The Rocket" plugin a lot. It's modelled after a 1176)

Side-Chain compression is nice as well to give a pumping effect or to help when your bassline plays along side your drumbeat so there's no real phasing problems if the kick and bassline hit the same frequency when your bassline and kick drum play at the same time. Basically you can set it to whenever your kick drum is triggered, it ducks the volume of the bassline in that instance, thus allowing the kick to punch through the mix and not battle with the bassline in that frequency spectrum.

Transient designers are cool to fuck with as well to make your percussion sound longer or shorter. Compression alters this as well, but transient designers go a bit further to focus in specially on the transients. (Check out "SPL Transient Designer" & Cakewalk's "PX-64 Percussion Strip" plugin)

Of course EQ as well, especially something with some vintage style saturation I say. (I like the V-Comp series a lot from Waves and PSP sQuad EQ's)
 
Sydal

Sydal

Sicc OG
#12
Apr 25, 2002
7,232
170
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www.idealsentertainment.com
#12
Filthy_Rich said:
i've seen this guy's shit too. he's full of crap. he had one about mastering tracks. all he did was apply an EQ preset to the master out.
Click to expand...
Yup. The entire "EXPERTVILLAGE" camp is full of shit. All their "tutorials" are like, a minute and a half long with no real explanation on anything. And really, who needs a fuckin' tutorial on volume adjustment? If they do, they should be accountants. I like how he shifted the focus to the "BYPASS" feature when he didn't know what the fuck he was talking about.

I fuck with Logic tutorials from SFLogicNinja...that dude is helpful as fuck.
 
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